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AVC HD on Premiere Pro

Update 10-3-08 – CS4 has been announced and included in Premiere Pro CS4 is native AVCHD editing. Please go visit the Adobe website and check out all of the new features that are a part of Production Premium and Premiere Pro CS4

Update 6-16-08 – I’ve posted another entry that outlines several compatible solutions and one that you should take a look at. Here it is AVC HD and Premiere Pro Revisited

_______________

Main Concept, a company that Adobe has long worked with just announced and shipped their MPEG Pro HD 3 plugin for PC.  This new package delivers a variety of new editing capabilities to Premiere Pro 2 and CS3 users including AVC-HD.

I can’t say that I’ve tried it yet: I just got a serial # today.  Chances are that Dave Helmly will do a piece on this once he’s put it thru it’s paces.  If so, I’ll be sure to post a link.  Still, I thought it worth mentioning since AVC-HD has been in asked about so much recently.

In addition to AVC-HD, it supports a variety of Sony formats including XDCAM, XDCAM HD and now XDCAM EX.

There’s a whole bunch to dig into and it looks like they already have a trial download set up so download it, give it a try and let me know what you think.

MPEG Pro HD 3 by Main Concept

When I get a chance to put it thru its paces, I’ll be sure to let you know what I find.

Comments

Hi!
It’s quite remarkable to see a company of Adobe’s size telling their users that they don’t have enough resources instead of solving the problem. It is not a problem that the users should even consider, it is up to Adobe as a company to solve the problem.
I would recommend all dissatisfied users to change supplier. Adobe will not be taking responsibility for their problems in the near future since they seem to think that it is a hazzle to handle new formats that keep coming out? It’s really quite ridiculus to read about Adobe’s thoughts about this above. Money talks. Give them to someone that care’s about your requests.

Any word on when native support is going to come out? i dont want to pay more $ for a plugin

We have tried using a Blackmagic Intensity card to capture footage directly from the CMOS on our Canon HF-100 AVCHD camcorder. The results are good but there are conflicts with sound drivers on our editing workstation. The time had come to add two new editing systems. We have decided to go with Mac Pros, and whilst we were about it, bought Final Cut Studio. We are a school in UK so this worked out quite cheap. I’ll be sorry to move on from Adobe Prem Pro though. I guess Adobe have got fed up catering for amateur set ups and now have bigger fish to fry. So long, and thanks for all those fish…

… 8 month later and nothing changed! still no support or goog workaround especially for mac users! adobe this is a real shame! you say you provide customer service with this blog here but hey, nothing is changing at all! and this for over 8 month now… this is much too long and the next version for me is not a pricy update but FinalCut! You are loosing more and more customers=money on this!

[DR - I disagree. We've put up other resources, responded to most every comment and have posted an entry on solutions. We do not have a native solution yet, granted, but we've addressed the problem in every other way.]

When I looked at the tech note linked above I didn’t see Nero Vision among the programs listed – which is a pity as it can transcode AVCHD to HDV and the reverse, and burn AVCHD DVDs with menus, and makes a handy companion to PPro. It can also do smart render of AVCHD and for quick and simple AVCHD editing it can’t be beaten – but it’s no PPro in terms of features!

I’ve been trying the Mainconcept plugin with PP2.0 and was quite excited at first about its AVCHD functionality – until I tried adding a colour balance effect and it ground to a crawl on playback even on a Q9300 quad core PC. Programs such as Pinnacle Studio 12 don’t turn a hair at such a task. I get the feeling that PPro would need to have a lot of work done under the hood to add native AVCHD handling – it’s not something that can simply be tacked on to the existing engine as some kind of free upgrade.

So I’ll keep my money in my pocket and use Nero for transcoding if I want to use PPro.

But whatever the outcome of all of this is, you’ll need a quad core PC (or Mac equivalent) on top of the price of your AVCHD camcorder to run any native implementation.

I downloaded the free Main Concept AVC-HD to DVCPRO Transcoder for my Panasonic camera, and its not a bad temporary solution. Although it takes a couple of hours to convert about 14 GB of ACDHD (m2ts files) footage, it transforms it to almost 100 GB of MXF files, which uses up too much hard drive space. Is there any way to keep the converted files size to a reasonable level?

Like many of the posters, I refuse to buy the $400+ plug-in, which I think is a slap in the face to PP CS3 users. My friends who use FC (I’m the lone Windows guy in the group) are having a good laugh over this. Please provide a solution to this issue quickly.

Thanks

I am an amateur using PP CS3 and a Sony AVCHD. This is what I have so I need a way to make it work. I have no complaints about Adobe. Tried the trial MainConcept plug-in. There’s no control. Would like your recommendation of what would give me capture and control just like my previous Sony Camcorder with firewire had. That worked great. Would the BMD give me this?

I’ve been trying workarounds to Prem Pro’s lack of native avchd support.

1. Cyberlink PowerDirector 6 is a huge improvement on the older versions, and has native avchd support (which works well for my Canon HF100), but it doesn’t feel as “solid” as Prem Pro.

2. To date, I have found the best solution is ShedWorx’s VoltaicHD transcoder, followed by import to Prem Pro. It takes a bit of time, but it does batch transcode and without an obvious drop in quality – maybe some movement artefact, but I’m not convinced. At $30, it’s hard to go wrong.

3. Can’t comment on the MainConcept plugin. I haven’t tried it as I can’t afford it – which I suspect goes for most people here.

Hi i,m Intresting to find out how can i make Adobe Premiere Pro 1.5 or 2.0 or CS3 to work with Pinnacle 700-PCI it comes with Pinnacle studio 11 Plus some plugins or driver or advice is good to me to help Please e-mail me on deki21@excite.com Thanks

[DR - As a former Pinnacle employee, I'm pretty sure that unless the Pinnacle folks say that it is compatible with Premiere Pro, that it will not work. Their propietary hardware necessitates drivers that are written for specific applications like Studio 11. My recommendation is to download the Premiere Pro trial and see if you can tap into the Studio 11 codecs by creating a custom Premiere Pro editing preset.]

The original purpose of this blog was to let people know about the MainConcept plugin. While none of us WANTS to spend more money to edit our video I have to say the MainConcept HD plugin is absolutely awesome. It is worth the money. I can now edit more than just AVCHD footage. I can now edit MOD files and other MPEG based files I have had problems with in the past. Now all my MPEG editing just works. I hope the Adobe solution works just as well as MainConcepts so all the people who have been waiting can have the same experience. Sorry Adobe. I couldn’t wait. But, I’ll never give up PP.

The original purpose of this blog was to let people know about the MainConcept plugin. While none of us WANTS to spend more money to edit our video I have to say the MainConcept HD plugin is absolutely awesome. It is worth the money. I can now edit more than just AVCHD footage. I can now edit MOD files and other MPEG based files I have had problems with in the past. Now all my MPEG editing just works. I hope the Adobe solution works just as well as MainConcepts so all the people who have been waiting can have the same experience. Sorry Adobe. I couldn’t wait. But, I’ll never give up PP.

Second try:

Does the plugin, or whatever other options you are recommending above for AVCHD support for Adobe products, work with Adobe Premier Elements 4.0? Your answer will help me decide on which camcorder to buy. Thanks a bunch for your help on this one.

- Amit.

[DR - in some cases like MPEG Pro from Main Concept, the answer is yes, but not always. Of course, the transcoding solutions will work since Premiere Elements supports DV, HDV, etc... I hope this helps you.]

This is truly unbelievable that a company with a reputation? like adobes should post a list of dubious (at best)workarounds on its website for a problem it should have resolved in house 3 years ago when the format was first released. The school I work at has just invested $15,000 On the masters suite to use across a number of faculties and we find that premiere pro Cs3 is functionally useless with just about every new camcorder on the market that is worth considering in todays marketplace.
Fix this and quick boyos!!!!

[DR - One point of clarification. AVC HD is not the predominant camcorder format on the market as you would imply above. DV still outsells everything by quite a margin and HDV continues to grow.

Until such time as we can implement AVCHD support, the point of the thread is to provide users a list of solutions that do work including some that are free.]

So, more than 2 years on and Adobe still have so little regard for their customers (who have paid thousands for crippled software unable to edit the main consumer high def camera format) that they can’t be bothered to produce some form of solution to AVCHD editing and then they produce the above hand-washing exercise out of ‘courtesy’.

And the recommended solution? Use a capture card. Wow, and I thought you guys had some understanding of video editing. How wrong was I??

Just for the record, AVCHD is mainly found on hard drive camcorders. Why is this relevant? Well, using a capture card is going to result in what should be a lightning fast data transfer happening in REAL TIME. There goes one of the main advantages of having a HDD unit.

Plus this ‘recommendation’ ignores the fact that the footage will be converted from AVCHD to an intermediate format for transmission. The intermediate format will then be converted into a new format for storage on the PC. I wonder what two sets of transcoding will do to the footage?

Alternatives: use a transcoder that will transcode at 1/12 speed, or pay more than the value of the software for a plug-in to do something that Adobe are to lazy to do themselves.

Sorry that last bit was unfair. You guys are not lazy. You can see that people will pay through the nose for a plug in, so logically they will pay a smaller sum to upgrade to a new version. That’s not laziness, it’s greed.

[DR - Ah James... I will try to comment, but keep it short as I've said most of what's needed previously...

1 - 2 years... I don't think so. While AVCHD has been out for a while, it's not been something customers have asked for until much more recently.
2 - the list of solutions is to provide a reasonable workarounds depending on customer needs and platforms. Even after we do have AVCHD support, there will be compelling reasons for some of these solutions that include capture cards.]

Just purchased a Sony HDR SR12 and then I purchased Adobe Premier Pro CS3 to capture HD Video from the camcorder. (Thanks to the customer service at Adobe – I was given bad advice)

It does not work!!!!

Now I just downloaded something from MainConcept that claims it acts as a bridge between the camera and Adobe. It still does NOT recognize my camcorder.

Is this because the Sony camcorder is attached to the computer by USB and NOT a firewire? It seems that the camcorder doesn’t have a firewire port!!

Can anyone help me?

All I want to be able to do is capture video clips from my camcorder onto my computer in an acceptable format….ie. avi.

The software that comes with the camcorder is worthless. It can only be viewed using their software!!!

HELP PLEASE!!!!

Looks like someone (Dennis?) has put up the list of current transcoding options at:
http://kb.adobe.com/selfservice/viewContent.do?externalId=kb403297

Nick

[DR - Can't take credit for this one Nick, but I have taken the time to post up the link as well as comment on it. Thanks!]

Panasonic AVCHD to P2 transcoder ver. 1.2 will only work with AVCHD files acquired with Panasonic cameras.

Version 1.1 works with my Canon acquired AVCHD files.

I have discovered this when downloading the second time to my other workstation without first noticing the version.

Will the AVCHD suppor be available for Premier Elements 4.0 as well, when it does become available? Will it be an “upgrade”/ $$? Are we looking at 3Q this yr (short term) or sometime next year (long term) for a Adobe solution to be available?

Dennis,

Thanks for the tip on the Panasonic tool. Only one problem though – when you try it with files recorded on a Sony camcorder, it refuses to transcode them, saying that they were recorded on a non-panasonic camera.
What should one do if you cannot afford the Main Concept plug in or an upgrade to CS4 and have a Sony camera?

[DR - Dave, this was told to me to be compatible with Sony cameras as well, but in looking at the link again, it seems they are making Panasonic cameras only. Let me look into it if I can. Thanks for letting me know.]

Hi, you are right FCP has no native AVCHD support BUT the way they solved it is awesome! you can import each scene and before you can have a look so you don´t have to import al scenes. FCP is transcoding into apple intermediate codec and this is perfect for editing. this way is perfect for me and should be a great solution for PP to. why is adobe not implementing this workflow for the moment? the only disadvantage is that the codec needs lots of disc space… but this not a problem right now a 1TB HDD is just around 100$.

[DR Heiko - There are two potential issues with transcoding. First there is the issue of time. It takes you longer to get started with the editing. The second is a question of quality. Any time you convert your footage, you are theoretically taking a hit in quality, though I think this is largely bunk...

As I've mentioned before, there is the free Panasonic software that will transcode your AVCHD to DVCPROHD which is about the same data rate as ProRes (at certain levels). So in that sense, we have a solution that's as good as FCP's right now.

Also, if you like ProRes and have both FCS and Production Premium, you can edit your AVCHD/ProRes footage in Premiere Pro right now. Just create a custom preset that uses the ProRes codec...

It ultimately comes down to a choice of workflows - do you want to do transcoding or do you want to edit natively?]

At the risk of spoiling the lynching, Dennis is correct above. According to the Apple FCP6 website, the AVCHD files can be previewed and clips defined directly off the SDHD card, but they need to be transcoded to Apple’s ProRes 422 format (using an Apple Pro) prior to further editing.

In their ProRes 422 white paper they state “New codec formats such as these
[H.264 etc (implying AVCHD)] can be ideal for compressing and preserving such
high-quality source imagery at data rates low enough for internal camcorder storage.
However, some of these new codecs are too complex to achieve the software decoding speeds needed to support the level of multistream real-time editing performance that Final Cut Pro users have come to expect.

(My emphasis) Apple ProRes 422 provides an excellent means of handling these new formats…

This is, as far as I can see, the dilemma Adobe are facing at the moment, to transcode like Apple (which can be done by external applications or hardware already) or to take the AVCHD in as a native format.

Dennis, I really think you might help yourself a lot if you gave yourself a break from answering questions and put together the promised really clear list options and clear instructions for the various free and costly software and hardware transcoding workarounds.

It would give a lot more feeling of support to the unhappy customers than the political answers you are forced to give to the “When” question.

Regards

Nick
(Honestly not connected to Adobe!!!!)

[DR - Thanks Nick, my neck feels better already. Also, regarding your statement that I need to own up and do the post I talked about is a true one. Battling time and other Adobe demands is never ending but that doesnt mean I shouldn't do it. Keep reminding me! ;-)]

I used Pinnacle Studio for quite some time. When it worked, it was a good program to use. But because I had invested in it, I was compelled to use it. when they did their last upgrade, I lost all of my Smart sound tracks. Pinnacle could not help me. So, I turned to Adobe and purchased Creative Suite Production Premier. I am not a professional by any means, but I like to video. To my dismay, I found that my Sony HDR-SR1 won’t work with the soft ware. I purchased Sony’s HDR-HC9 Camera which has an HD format for DV. It won’t work either. So here I sit not able to do anything with the footage I have taken. And I know that you are going to tell me about work arounds. The amount of money people have invested in Adobe should be a trigger to get something happening sooner than later. I now know that research is important. How many customers would you have lost or not gained if people did the research?
Very Frustrated Eric

It´s enough now. We are waiting now too long. we are using 8! macs using PPCS3 right now. we don´t need avchd support on all of them but we tested finalcut the last weeks and the avchd support is excellent! we are waiting now for over one! yes 1 year on native avchd support and it´s still in the beta phase… and what is more important to us we have all macs with cs3 so if avchd is on cs4 only we will definatly change! i think this is what all of the cs3 users think. a update just for cs4 is impossible for us! and hey adobe please recalculate how much users you lost on avchd and how much you will loose if it is just in cs4! so i think we are waiting another 3 month and then go for finalcut. sorry adobe but this is the bill for not supporting a major (and not only conumer!!!) camcorder format.

[DR - one clarification, Final Cut Pro to my knowledge does not offer native AVCHD editing. It transcodes the content to another codec.]

Hi Dennis,
I’m another long-term Adobe “hobby” customer (currently SD with Premiere 1.5 and with Matrox RTX-100 support). As my Panasonic´s DV mechanism has just broken I´m looking at a replacement and AVC HD looks like the way ahead!

I’d like to add that as an embedded software team leader I understand your frustrations!

Reading between the lines, could I summarise the situation as follows?

It seems that

- AVC HD, whilst a great CODEC for high compression of continuous video streams, is far from ideal for non-linear editing

- Adobe are having a long hard look at whether real-time editing of this standard is actually feasible (their ideal solution) or whether a transcoding to a CODEC better suited to NLE is a more practical idea.

- Other competing products have already made this decision, and produced products, but none of these are anywhere near ideal.

- There are already free software and hardware solutions to this. The hardware transcoding of HDMI signals to a more suitable CODEC is at present the best solution.

- Given the difficulty of the problem it is more likely that AVC HD will hold up CS4 than the other way round. (I don´t expect any answer to this one!)

- I would greatly appreciate your comments on the above. I’ve also a couple of questions to which I don´t have an answer:

- Is it likely that the ever increasing power of forthcoming PCs will resolve this problem in the near future, so that the obvious choice becomes using the native AVC HD format, or is that too far ahead?

- Is the Blackmagic Design Intensity card using BMDs jpeg codec an excellent solution (like DV was for SD) and if not why not?

- Will European formats e.g. 25p be fully supported – especially given the strange way the Canon DF10/100 encodes them?

Many thanks for your help, and I look forward to your response
Nick Lusty (UK)

[DR - Nick, no doubt you are a coder or blogger in your own right since I was stripping out your syntax (not needed with this system). Let me tackle your questions and pass on others!

- YES! AVCHD is less than ideal for editing
- Basically yes, we're trying to evaluate the best overall solution based on customer feedback.
- Well, that depends on the customers perspective...
- That's my opinion. I'm okay with HDMI to a JPEG codec/DVCPro or uncompressed. Intensity cards are a whopping $249 - very reasonable and gives you some I/O to boot.
- I'm glad you don't expect an answer ;-) wink
- Yes, I think continuing evolution of PCs will make this argument largely obsolete much as it has with MPEG2 streams. The parallels between MPEG2 and AVCHD are very similar.
- Yes, I like BMD for the money.
- unknown but very likely as we go out of our way to support as many aspects of each codec. DVCProHD support includes 1080 and 720 as an example.

Cheers Nick...]

Here’s a blog article on some of the problems the Mac and by extension Apple editing software is experiencing. It shows that we’re all grappling with some of these issues.

Now, I know you’ll say, “at least they have support!” True, but my point is to mention that it isn’t all rosy just to say you have the support.

http://www.macworld.com/article/133790/2008/06/camcorder.html

happy friday.

I was at the New York event and I did travel aways to get there. So, if it wasn’t for the word gentleman I may be the person Dennis referenced. I did get to meet him. He personafies all the good things reflected in the handling of this site. He is one neat guy. I was glad to see that last post by David C. and the response from Dennis.
I think that most of the complaints are simply wrongheaded.
MPEG-4 AVC/H.264 Information
is a must visit site. Do it before you read on!
Now you know, MPEG-4 is an “open standard” and that is an oxymoron. Maybe we could live with that except for another word “exclucivity”, the CEO’s holy grail. I own three Sony camers,a P1 point and shoot,a VX2000 and a HDR-SR11 and there are media incompatabilities
amoung the three of them.
Look i’ve done software for 40 years, all phases, system and application and no I have no association with Adobe except as a customer. Dennis has given us Adobe’s, priorities CS3 was a big rollout, he’s done several me.a cul.pa’s on our codex problem. Software development is a damm cite harder than hardware. I don’t know what kind of helpfull software came with the other MPEG-4 cameras but Sony really dissapointed me with the crap that came with there’s. last comment for this post Adobe solution sooner than later. More to come about NYC it was a blast. Please consider a note to the standards Group and your neighborhod camera manufacture.

[DR - Thanks for the kind words and information Gerald.]

Well, the two big questions are: will it be available as a patch or is this part of the new version of pp and when might this come out.

Other than that, sounds GREAT!

Hi – I was excited to read this last post that talked about avchd info at the NY event. I’ve taken your advice and looked around for other blogs that mention it, but have not found any. Could you be kind enough to talk about it here please?

On a side note, I just used my hdr-sr12 to film my buddy’s wedding and did so using avchd. I’d rather not wait too long for the avchd support to edit the movie for him. Any chance of an eta? It you know for a fact it won’t be for several months, could we know now (even that vague would help)? I will edit his wedding in SD if I have to, but would rather not have to. Thanks again and please keep us posted!

[DR - I will try to comment further soon, but here's the short version...

We showed AVCHD showing on a Mac playing natively and in realtime. It was based on the same tapeless workflow that we work with on P2 and XDCAM. That was basically it outside of a number of AVCHD presets. We used a Panasonic camera from Panasonic and actually edited directly of the camera media.

Let me know what else you'd like to hear about...]

Hi Dennis,
I have used Pinnacle Studio 11 for a while and downloaded Sony Vegas Pro trial.
Studio 11 does not burn to Blue ray, but does burn AVC HD to DVD, which you can than play on e.g. a PS3. Great quality, but Studio 11 is really slow, and limited.
Sony Vegas Pro does burn to Blue ray, but without any menu’s etc. So only one continuous video file.

When (not if) AVC HD support is added to Premiere, will I be able to create menu’s sub titles etc and burn the whole project to Blue ray?

Of course I would happily volunteer to test some beta version.
As a previous software and integration engineer I will find everything that does not perform according to specifications.

Best regards
Frans

[DR - Hey Frans. Thanks for the comments and the perspective. Unfortunately, we can't comment further on the features of AVCHD other than what I've already posted. As for the blu-ray support - we'll be doing it thru Encore obviously...and you won't have some of the limitations you mentioned.]

Referencing the post of May 28 as follows:

1) When will a patch for PP-CS3 that supports AVCHD be out?

[DR - here you go...
1 - don't know and as time goes on it's more likely that it will be CS next and not CS3

---

DR...Don't you feel you've been a bit disingenuous in telling CS3 users to be patient? In telling CS3 users that they are valuable, and that it's 'not if but when' is a reasonable person likely to conclude taht CS3 will support AVCHD? The criticism and questions came from CS3 users such as myself who are clearly not asking whether CS4 will support AVCHD, but rather when will CS3 support it. I believe a fair and objective analysis of your previous posts dating back 5 months give every impression that AVCHD support will be a patch and not a new 'feature'. You have taken great pains to tell people to be patient when you should have been telling them that there is a very good possibility that AVCHD would be a feature of a future release. I highly doubt that this decision was not known internally for some time while you continued to offer the impression that CS3 users would ultimately be well served by Adobe.

Not offering the full information regarding AVCHD support being planned for CS4 is highly deceptive and will no doubt be regarded by many as a lie by omission. I would not be surprised if your posts were cited by a few attornies as well.

[DR - Hey there D Midi...are you a music guy?

I do not think I am being disingenuous. I am trying to provide information and address questions that I can answer. Also, since this thread has continued far past anything I ever imagined, you have to realize that the length of comments is subject to the relevance of time. Things have changed during the course of the last six months and so have my comments. My recourse to address this would be to either edit each comment (not possible with the amount of time needed) or delete them all (not fair to everyone who has posted). Thus I am left with the choice of leaving everyone to read through it all and come to their own conclusions.

As I've stated before, I am somewhat constrained in what I can say as an Adobe employee. We are a publicly traded company (ADBE) and as a public figure, my comments even on this blog could be read and interpreted. As such, I am understandably careful with what I say.

That being said, I try to provide as much information as I possibly can and you can expect that from me on this and anything else from Adobe.]

I’ve only been following this thread for a week. I wish I’d red it two weeeks ago. I have a Canon HF-10 and have tried various software routes to achieve successful editing in CS3: Elecard AVCHD, Sony Vegas Pro 8, Mainconcept CS3 plug-in. None of them satisfactory. I purchased a BlackMagic Intensity card a few days ago. It does not respond as it should. After reading detailed support notes on the BlackMagic website, I now realise I need a lot more resources on my PC, namely a 4 or 6 drive array. The system I tested the card on only has one drive, although every thing else should be fine. BlackMagic recommend Raid 0 arrays with 6 HDDs with 15K spindle speed for successful High Def capture to the Intensity card. Beware! I will test the card on my work PC tomorrow, though this only has a two drive Raid 0 array with 7200 rpm spindle speeds.

Concider me interested in the beta test. I would be perfectky happy to try and tear into the program and log my findings. I am going to be doing a lot of video work on the road this summer and will be out of the country (attempting to be) doing daily updates via podcast for people back home. any solution to elemenate capture and transcode time prior to edits would be awesome

Just another frustrated HDR11 owner who can’t use CS3 in editing. The video comes out fine but without Audio. I can export on NERO but with deficient quality. Can you put me on a mailing list when an appropriate plug-in comes into effect. I am very disappointed to learn that I invested in this top of the line camera and cannot edit with it.

So was any AVCHD info divulged today?

[DR - We showed it playing in Premiere Pro natively in real-time with no transcoding. One gentleman had come from a long way to see it and was happy. I'm hoping that some of the attendees that showed up yesterday will post their own thoughts rather than my own...]

Hi,
I’ve been reading your blog for some time now and i appreciate your commitment to this subject.
I have a sony AVC HD Camcorder and I think I can help with the beta test. Can you please send it to me?

Regards

[DR - Josh, thanks for the comments. As for beta testing, I've seemingly gotten a lot of request for this, but candidly, we are not going to have many candidates. ]

I have a grant for my educational podcast to go video and bought PP-CS3. I’m glad I found this thread as I was about to buy the Canon HG-10 (and would still like to do so). As grant money is limited and must be spent in a given time frame, I must spend under $1000 on the camera by the end of the summer, which knocks me out of most of the supported hardware options listed on the Adobe site. The Canon HV-10 has the right price and its format is supported, but no mic jack. The sense I get is that there are free work arounds, but they are time consuming and possibly quality degrading. I think it can be agreed that this is not acceptable. I guess I really want to ping this forum to ask the most basic questions laid out near the beginning of this discussions. The first was if you guys were working on this problem, and obviously you are. The other questions I don’t have a good bead on:
1) When will a patch for PP-CS3 that supports AVCHD be out?
2) Will it be free?
3) If it will not be free (much potential grumbling), how much of my grant money will I have to sacrifice to this unexpected fix?
4) If you don’t have answers to the above, do you have an estimated date that you do think you can give answers to the above?
Your feedback will help me with a very time and money sensitive issue.
Thanks DR

[DR - here you go...
1 - don't know and as time goes on it's more likely that it will be CS next and not CS3
2 - if a patch is made available in CS3, then most likely it would be free. Both 3.1 and 3.2 were free for Premiere Pro and they added DVC PRO HD and XDCAM flavors
3 - unknown but I would point you to our historical upgrade costs as guidance]

Well I’ve been waiting for some real software to support HD video. It’s seems AVCHD is here to stay.

I just want a Hard drive camcorder that shoots 1080i (1080p?) that I can connect to a pc and edit into a clip that I can burn to a DVD or Blueray. I would prefer it work in real time.

So here I wait to see when you’ll have a list of supported camera’s. I have the Blackmagic card but don’t have the time to play with it. My assumptions are that it will take a long time to encode the HD video for me to edit it.

I’ve got High end Xeon PC workstations running XP at my disposial but can’t pick a camera to buy to edit from.

[DR - if you have a blackmagic card that has an HDMI input, you're good to go. You can capture from the AVCHD camera via the HDMI into BMD's mjpeg codec which solves the editing hassles of AVCHD. I would give it a try.]

I hope that when Premiere natively supports AVCHD also “Smart Rendering” is available. As far as I can see, no other product or add-on supports this yet.

Thanks for your updates on this topic and I hope you soon have good news for us all.

I am really interested in participation in the AVCHD beta. I own Adobe Premiere Elements 4.0 (yes paid for it, not downloaded it) on a Quad core AMD with Vista Ultimate. I use a Canon HF-100 flash based AVCHD camcorder. I also have Sony Vegas, Premiere Pro 1.5 exprience and other NLE’s.

I work as an ICT consultant and I know about beta and pilot testing and I am willing to put some time in it and send appropriate feedback and retest again.

I was wondering about buying a new camera, but all the good options, for my use, uses AVCHD. All info I can find on the Internet says that Premiere Pro CS3 does not yet support AVCHD.

A few days ago I called my Norwegian technical support at Adobe, which told my that if I had downloaded the latest patch, Premiere Pro CS3 would support AVCHD. Is this true?

We are a multimedia company and just bought about 10 Canon HF10s to start off. All the equipment and accessories are ready except for the software. Six more months and it’s going to be a year since you started this post. How could Adobe be so far behind? AVCHD is definitely the future of HD Video. It’s like Pioneer or Samsung not making Blu-Ray players. Adobe needs to jump on the ball and outsource the work if their programmers can figure it out.

I would like to thank your for your continued support of this topic. I am coming back here nearly daily to see any developments. I am glad that AVCHD is finally being teased a little. That would normally mean just a short while before a real solution is in place.

Again thank your DR for keeping this forum flowing. Especially with such a difficult and sore subject for many of us. I agree it has been too long a wait, but again would rather have it be right than a mere band-aid.

[DR - thanks for the encouragement and of course, "we hear you!" ;-)]

It saddens me it is taking this long to implement the AVCHD format in Adobe Premiere. (if you can’t do it natively why not provide users with transcoder plugins or something of the sort.)

MAY 9th you said there are FREE work arounds. I tried some, they don’t work very good. I used XPORT and FFMPEG to convert, it works playing off players like VLC and MEDIA PLAYER although PREMIERE doesn’t produce the video, only audio.

SO MY QUESTION TO YOU IS:

in a previous post you STATED (mat 9th) :

“” DR – L. As for your wedding, as already established in the many comments, there are workarounds that are free and easy to employ””

what are THESE FREE WORK AROUNDS. Do you have a DETAILED INSTRUCTIONS step by STEP and FREE downloadable tool available? Can you please provide us with this information?

[DR - Silverbyte, in this now extended list of comments and replies by myself, I see that I've mentioned things like the Panasonic transcoder which I see as the most viable (and free) option so far. Others have mentioned other solutions. It has been my intention for some time to outline what all of these options are and to compare them. Unfortunately, my schedule has not allowed me to do this (I'm currently in LA this week...NY the next, San Francisco the week after)

So, I would encourage you to read through the thread and dig into some of what's been mentioned. You might also go to the Adobe forums and search there as well to get some specific step-by-step directions.]

19 May 08

(Bump)

Another Sony HDR-SR user waiting on integrated AVC support.

We are part-time (amateur) users, who don’t understand everything a lot of people have said, and are probably not that important customers for you, as we’ve been using PP 1.5 since we got it a few years back, and have had no need to upgrade, as it did all we required. We don’t even have AE.

We have one point and two questions:

a) Parity of platforms is nonsense. We’re PC users, but if AVCHD (or any other useful addition) was available on a Mac now, wouldn’t expect them to wait for us, as long as you promised you were on the case.

b) As stated, we’re not that tekno-savy, but if, as these threads seem to imply, PP supports HDV (does PP1.5?) and this is supperior to the normal low deff .avi we use, why can’t you offer an AVCHD-HDV converter on the website that can be downloaded free with a product reg code?

c) We’ve just got an AVCHD Sony. That’s why we found this forum. We were shocked, as poor amateurs, that PP won’t work with it. As we only have PP1.5 (we don’t even know what CS3 is), will the plug-in be free for PP1.5 users, and compatable with it? We would like to stay with PP if you really are trying and it isn’t, as many seem to fear, an attempt to make people pay for an upgrade), but we don’t know how your upgrades work. How much do they cost (1.5 – 2.0 – CS3 etc). Cos if we have to pay loads to upgrade so the AVCHD plud-in will work, or worse, pay loads to upgrade to CS4, effectively buying a new system, then we will see what offers best value for our particular circumstances.

This is why parity should be dropped (if you did bring out a PC version now, would it work with PP1.5?), and a free file converter offered.

However, if being a PP1.5 owner is effectively worthless in terms of getting AVCHD when you do it (because we would have to pay shedloads to upgrade before we could use the plug-in, saving next to nothing compared to a new customer) can you please tell us now, so we can start looking at different software and platform options.

It’s a pity we can’t just edit the converted files in PP and then convert the EDL into Vegas or something.

Thanks for trying to help, anyway.

Ganpati bless

Oh yea, BTW, I can’t get premiere to recognize the camera either. So I can’t capture footage from it. :( Open for suggestions on that one also.

I just got a Sony HDR-SR11. I have to say I’m disappointed that it’s not plug and play with my Premiere Pro CS3!

I just tried the steps above. It has converted it to .avs files, but when they import I get an error:
Configuration GUI not run Resize set to Bilnear Rescaling.
I click ok, the video comes in, but all messy. I can see 1/2 of the frame. Then when I click on it, premiere crashes.
Open for suggestions. Very sad, all my saved up money, and can’t edit a video.

Thanks in advance.
Brian

Assuming the “NYC Event”, was there a teaser demo? Patiencely waiting.
Gerald Oh anything further on Alpha or Beta participation ?

[DR - yes, there will be a teaser demo on AVC HD at the New York event and we'll have a field guy who has done a lot of playing with it. If you're around the area, I certainly hope you will sign up. The link is
http://www.eventsadobe.com/dvtools/index.html

as for beta participation, it's generally tough to get in unless you're very willing to bang on the application to find bugs, log them and then try them against new builds. Most people want to see the new version and learn all of the new features. That's understandable, but that is not beta testing. If you think you're willing to commit, post another comment and I'll possibly email you privately.]

How in the world can you continue to make excuses about not supporting AVCHD. I spent $1300 on a Sony HDR-SR11 and have to convert everything to fuzzy mpegs to use Premiere Pro 2.0.

This is friggin’ ridiculous. Develop a plug-in and move into the modern era. Jeez I could be making higher quality video if I had bought a cheaper, crappier camcorder.

How can Adobe be so tone deaf on such a key issue? It’s really unbelievable.

[DR - B-Man, we are certainly not ignoring the issue but as I've outlined in other comments, there are a number of issues to deal with. One being performance, two being cross platform solution, three being the implementation of the solution. There are many more, but in short we are working on it.]

What saddens me is that I bought a Canon HF10 after I was ASSURED by an Adobe Customer Rep that Premiere CS3 would have NO PROBLEM reading and editing in the AVCHD Format. I don’t want to be bitter with regard to Adobe, considering I’ve used thier products for years, but obviously there’s no way for me to prove whom I talked to…there may be a date logged somewhere, but I feel there should be a form of recompensation considering I would not have invested in a $1000 camera if I knew it wouldn’t work with my current software. So now, I have a wedding to shoot and I have to tell my clients that I can’t shoot in HD as originally promised. …wow. I don’t know how far this strand reaches, but in case my voice is heard, waiting for CS4 for AVCHD editing in 1080p 24fps is utterly unacceptable. I feel cheated and robbed by your company and its reps. Train them a little better, please.

[DR - L. It saddens me that our customer service might have made such a gross error. If you happen to have a caller number or relevant information (like a case #) I might be able to track something down for you.

As for your wedding, as already established in the many comments, there are workarounds that are free and easy to employ.]

I am lookup to upgrade my trusted (but old) Sony DCR-PC5 DV camera. I also own Adobe Premiere Elements. I always edit my DV movies and send them back to tape (backup) and burn them tot DVD for playback.

My initial choice was the Canon HV-30. However the new Canon HF-100 Solid state is also a fine chioce. If it was not for AVCHD.

I have now experimented with Voitec (http://www.shedworx.com) as a interdiate transcoder. It works fine with Adobe Elements and at $30 it is not expensive.

Untill Adobe has some sort of AVCHD support this will do nicely.

Sadly enough, I actually had AVCHD working in CS3 until the last patch where they “enhanced support” for sony cameras. And destroyed the import filter for .mp4. The only other thing installed was Nero7 Ultra, all source was encoded with Recode2. It just opened the .mp4′s with no problems, I presume using the Nero codex.
After the “enhancement” update the import filter for mp4 was messed up and they just say corrupt or unsupported. Rename them .MPEG, and they open… But with any 5.1 AAC missing. Sony doesnt own the .mp4 container. Adobe should put it back the way it was until they get a working import filter for the both of them under .MP4.

I tried AviSynth also. eek, almost compleatly unusable on a quad-core.

Hello,

Just wanted to let you know that I have tried the whole AVIsynth, and concluded it’s not a viable solution, even in “mean-time”. Four main reasons listed here:
1. Too slow to actually edit (fine for playing!!!) – a quad core system still too slow for smooth shuttling around
2. This method causes re-encoding of whole material, not just changed fragments = slow rendering, loss of quality.
3. Avisynth is not frame accurate with mp4 codecs – you can reload the project next day and find that the transitions/cuts aren’t in the same place as they were yesterday.
4. No export capability for HD full res – especially if you have 1920×1080 footage and want to export it to the same.
Really, at this stage, right now, a much better option is to reeencode your footage to HDV, which Premiere supports, and gives you good performance (probably due to most GPU’s having hardware MPEG2 decoders onboard)… we just need to wait till REAL MPEG4 hardware encoding becomes a standard.

If you don’t care about quality, why not reencode it to DV format (SD) and edit then. It will be fast, smooth… enough said…

I’m still waiting for the real solution after trying million workarounds, and nothing really does it. Vegas’ pre-rendering solution could be interesting – only if it worked.
I also tried “proxy” solutions (offline video, or using a DV footage to edit, then substitute with original AVCHD), but again, I’m stuck with Premiere not having export option to HD (either 1440×1080 or 1920×1080). I really wonder how Adobe will deal with such CPU-intensive codecs…

Dennis, have a good holiday, I wish I could see you guys on the 29th to give you hard time then ;-)

[DR - Greg, thanks for the comments and contribution to the thread.

Your comment about CPU-intensive codecs is very appropriate and one aspect that I think many readers don't accept. There are a lot (but not all) of products that purport to do AVC HD - but it is up to customers to do some digging to find out what's going on. Some big companies like Apple just transcode it and don't give you an option because they see it as unusable otherwise. That's not bad per se, but if you want native editing, it might take a pretty big system to make it work well. Other companies that readers have mentioned don't perform well, but at least they say they do AVC HD. That's marketing for you!

We will have a technology demonstration at the NYC event. Perhaps we'll tease you with an AVC HD demo.

Regards, DR]

I am lost on the whole script thing. Could you walk me through it as if I have no idea waht you are talking about, because I don’t but I would love to be able to edit my avchd clips in premiere. Any help is greatly apriciated, especially if you could post links to the files I need to download so I know I’m getting the right ones.

[DR - I haven't tried this, but i did publish another comment on this that outlined the steps. Since I am going on vacation, I will have to leave it to someone else to post their findings.]

So, when will AVCHD support (direct import from Sony sr12) be available?

Reluctantly, I am forced to switch to Sony’s Vega software. I bought a sony hdr sr1 1 1/2 years ago. Still no support. I am buying a hdr sr12 this week. Just cannot wait any longer. What a shame.

[DR - Kambiz, there are methods that have been outlined in these threads.]

Yes that is where I got the AVCHD import info from.
http://forum.videohelp.com/topic334524.html

And further more it does only work for Windows, because of the DirectShow requirements.

Step 1: Install AVIsynth.exe, MatroskaSplitter.exe PremiereAVSPlugin.exe also a DirectShow AVCHD decoder.

Step 2: Find your AVCHD files (*.mts) directory.

Step 3: Run windows CMD

Step 4: Enter the Directory of your (*.mts) files

Step 5:
#Type the Following into the prompt.

for %x in (*.mts) do (echo.DirectShowSource^(“%x”,25^)) > “%~nx.avs”

Step 6: Import the created *.avs script file into Premiere or AfterEffects.

The workaround for AVCHD is not perfect but its way faster than transcoding. Making scripts to import takes only seconds whereas transcoding can take hours.

I have forgotten to mention , but you can indeed edit AVCHD with Premiere without transcoding.

How? you might ask. Well do a little research on GOogle (keyword: Premiere,AviSynth, AVCHD).

I am not sure if I am allowed to give specifics , but I have tried it via importing scripts.

I am just waiting for ADOBE to do it automatically , so I can be laughing silly at FCP users because Adobe Premiere can edit AVCHD and my workflow is cool.

BTW.I even tried it with AfterEffects .

[DR - Beth, I've found what you're talking about and don't see any reason not to share...you won't hurt my feelings!

If you can add to this, it would be appreciated:
http://forum.videohelp.com/topic334524.html

Please note that this looks to be for PC users only.]

Keep up the good work Adobe.

I have been an early adopter of the HVX200 which is an HD camera with the P2 format (.mxf file), for those who don’t know. At that time support for mxf was scarce.

Waiting for the native support in CS3 was worth the wait, because nobody does it like Adobe when it comes to Application Integration via the Creative Suite.

The FCP guys don’t know what they are really missing.

I have never believed the hype about FCP is better and it’s the pro’s choice, because Adobe CS is awesome.

I am confident that ADOBE will do good with AVCHD when released. Just like what they did with MXF.

Just hurry up will ya…HEHEHEHEHEHE:}

[DR - see people, Beth is saying what I've been saying and I didn't even pay her off. ;-)

Seriously, thanks Beth and glad you appreciate the tapeless workflow we've got going for P2]

There are no smooth ways to get the AVCHD Files in PPCS3 for Mac users i think and thats a shame. Mainconcept is only supporting windows and not mac! Voltaic does not support progressive modes and all the other programms just run on a pc. can you please tell me a simple way to get my avchd 30p files in PP? (By the way you can´t be serious to say to the adobe users to go for the mainconcept plugin. its hundreds of dollars and i think before the PP users by this they would go for another compatible editing software like Vegas etc.). So can you please tell me a way to get my files into pp? i imported into imovie and now i have AIC mov files which are really amaising quality. but when i import the AIC mov files in PP CS3 they are stuttering. is there a way to get them working right. this might be the solution for me right now. thanks

[DR - Pete, you outline one of the obstacles that Adobe faces with regards to AVCHD. We could have AVCHD support right now if we were a PC only company but since Premiere Pro has gone back to the Mac, we are very committed to continuing to offer parity between the Mac and PC users.

I have heard (but haven't had time to try) the fact that you could take the codecs from ilife (imovie) and use them in Premiere Pro CS3 on the Mac. Certainly, if you capture in imovie, you can create a Premiere Pro Mac custom preset that will allow you to edit the AVCHD material captured by imovie. So, there are ways to edit AVCHD on the Mac.

As I'm reading your comments, I see that you're already part of the way there, so let me outline what I would do to make it work. Let me know if it does for you.

1) New project
2) Custom SEttings
3) Under capture settings, choose the appropriate codec that Apple uses to capture AVCHD.
4) Under General, choose editing mode to be desktop
5) Make sure the rest of the parameters under the General tab are correct as well

That should be it. If anyone tries it, please post your findings here. Thanks.]

I have to agree with the choir on this one…it’s May, NAB has come and gone and still no word on AVCHD or H264?? I know you mentioned the timing was ‘off’ and I hate to beat a dead horse but the turn around on this one has been way too slow!

I too am a big Adobe supporter but am really frustrated by the poor format support. Since Vista’s release, I’m considering Mac more seriously than ever and Final Cut is looking like a better option than Premiere. While they have to convert the files, at least I can get my projects done.

hi thanks for the comments here! i have a big problem. i have a avchd camcorder and user PP CS3. As we know there is no way to get avchd in PP right now :-(. so i´m using a mac and i don´t know how to get these files in PP? the voitec tool just supports 1080i and not 1080p (24 and 30). can you please post a work around i can get the 1080p files with a mac into PP please which costs not hundred of dollars. otherwise i can´t use PP CS3. Thanks a lot Klaus

[DR - thanks for taking the time to write the comment. I disagree with your first statement. There are lots of ways to get AVCHD into Premiere Pro - just not straight with Adobe at present. Another user has posted his findings which I appreciate and I've mentioned several other products, including the original article of this blog thread which talked of MPEG Pro 3 from MainConcept. Mac users also have solutions. Check out the solutions available and if you have questions, post again. Good luck!]

While were are all waiting for native support in CS3, I took some time and documented my work flow with AVC-HD footage (24p 1920×1080):
http://www.google.com/notebook/public/11794499350958156719/BDSGpIgoQuq3kvpcj

The method uses free tools *) and is transcode-less for the final rendering. I use it with the Canon HF10 and Premiere Pro CS3, but a similar method might work for other cameras or Premiere releases.

*) free except for Morgan MJPEG V3, that is not absolutely needed.

[DR - Coert, well done and thanks for taking the time to publish it. I've talked about the AVCHD to DVCProHD transcode from Panasonic, but you've mentioned others as well. I keep meaning to write my follow up article on other methods, but I've always got something else that is interfering! Thanks again and hopefully this will help some users.]

Adobe, you disgust me. I purchased Adobe Master Collection as soon as it came out, spending heaps for a student on a limited budget. Now I find it won’t work with AVCHD, a mainstream format where as Apple and Ulead do support it. Your tech support staff told me to swap to Apple. No kidding, another $1200 down the drain. My gosh, Photoshop works great but you guys have to clean up your act. Customer loyalty isn’t free, we expect respect.

[DR - We do respect you in a variety of ways. One would be your student license which is less than half of a normal license. The second is a variety of updates that are free and add new codecs and workflows such as DVCProHD and XDCAM EX. Those don't help you, but it does speak of our commitment to customers.]

DR – I’m in the same boat as most of these other folks, but I gotta say I feel for you. Good on Adobe that they have someone like you out here taking the heat and answering the tough questions.

[Chris - thanks, I really do appreciate it and glad that some people understand the intent here.]

I have been using Adobe products for many years. Have bought a Panasonic AVCHD camera and your forcing me to go and learn new packages when I want to spend my money with you….come on give a commitment to some loyal customers here.

[DR - John, you have our commitment. The question is one of when, to which some are unsatisfied. As mentioned before, you can use Panasonic's free AVCHD to DVCProHD software and edit with Premiere Pro.]

just bought a canon hf100 and it is not supported by the newest premiere pro cs3? what a shame on adobe! we are using the hf100 for special recordings besides our canon pro cams. we do not change our setup now but i think we are looking to change the setup in the future to FCP. Finalcut is supporting AVCHD a long time and you folks are working on it for over half a year? thats not professional handling! sorry adobe but this is really poor support!

[DR - Hi Wolfgang, as I've mentioned in many other responses, it's not as if we're sitting on our thumbs. More importantly, we've been working on superior tapeless workflows that will ultimately benefit users of AVCHD. Right now, we have superior workflows for DVC Pro HD and XDCAM HD and EX.

Final Cut and others do support AVCHD today whereas we do not, but I will mention that they convert the files before being able to edit them. This impacts the creative process. We certainly hope to be able to do better when we get it done. In addition, there are workarounds on several levels including a similar solution to what FCP does right now - transcode to a different format. You can download an AVCHD to HDV or DVCProHD converter and edit away.

While not ideal, it does represent the same basic idea of what many other companies are doing today when dealing with AVCHD solutions.

Again, Adobe is committed to supporting as many codecs and formats as possible and we will continue to strive to win the support and satisfaction of our customers. For now, we have an uphill battle with AVC HD, but we hope that your patience will be rewarded.]

Hi:

With the addition of the new SONY camera presets there is now a 1920X1080 preset. SInce I have been composing AVCHD discs using the Nero plug in with CS3 then using NERO to burn the DVD, I presume the use of the full 1080i preset will allow creation of the intermediate AVCHD files faster and with less CPU usage — and with better clarity. Is that right?

The last DVD I burned from Premiere took 120 hours (double sided but about an hour long) but had three drop outs. ALl were when I moved the mouse to check how much longer. All had a drop out of the video but NO drop of the sound or the titles on track #2. Looks like Premiere is not interupt driven.

Any suggestions?

Barrie

[DR - Barrie, It must be me, but I'm not sure about exactly what you're using and your workflow. If you can describe it a bit more, I will try to comment on it. Thanks.]

As of today (april 2008) AVCHD is still not available on the latest CS3.

I was looking to buy the Adobe master collection but seing that i even can’t use My Sony SR11 movie directly on premiere make me goes another route…

In no way i’m going to add a 500$ plugin over a supposed “professional” package that worth 2500$ !

Adobe you just loose a customer, i’m not the only one as i can see…

Pinnacle is very nice and support the AVCHD for less than 200$ btw!

Hi,

Glad you keep adding to this page and keep responding! That’s great!

I just want to add my voice to those who would very much like native AVC HD support in Premiere. I do video’s (I have done nature, commercial concert DVD’s, weddings for friends etc) all with Premiere. I like the product very much. I now have a Sony SR7 and a new Sony SR12. Because I want to continue to use Premiere, I currently have to convert to HDV (and lose a little quality in the process) or buy the above plugin. Please add native AVC HD support into Premiere. It would really simplify my life. Hopefully you guys are working on it.

Waiting with bated breath,

Jim

[DR - Jim, you, me and several others would all like the support! The idea of native support is one of the issues we are dealing with. Like HDV when it came out, some companies transcoded it in order to edit, whereas we prefer to edit natively whenever possible. with AVC HD, it is h.264 (or MPEG4 if you will) and as a result, it is very demanding for the CPU to do a decode. iMovie, FCP, and several others are all doing a transcode rather than edit it natively.

Thanks for your comments - I do appreciate them.]

“I would respectfully disagree with your assessment that Adobe is arrogant in its attitude towards customers. If this were truly so, I would have cut off accepting comments on this thread about 5 months ago”… i just read adobe had decided not to implement avchd in cs3! ähhmmm i don´t know if this is true but it would fit right in… just think about the decission was made month ago and we are hoping here to get avchd support in cs3! this is just fooling your customers with this forum here! do you really think accepting comments is to care about your customers? it is absolutly not! i would prefer hard working on avchd in cs3! i think in a few weeks i will also work with FCP…this is no way to treat your long time customers sorry. no official statements nothing…even imovie supports avchd…so not adobe!

Yes, I’ve used Adobe Premiere for a long long time In this particular issue the arrogance of the company towards it’s customers is 100 per cent. unacceptable.

Today, my business went and spend a lot of money buying Apple hardware along with 3 copies of FCP. When working with clients I need to feel I can trust the companies that I buy software from. From all angles Adobe have really misunderstood its customer base and Apple appear to be focussed like a leopard stalking it’s prey.

Goodbye Adobe, hope your shareholders and management find some better teams to deliver what the rest of the world has done in a very short space of time.

D

[DR - Hi David, thanks for the comment. I would respectfully disagree with your assessment that Adobe is arrogant in its attitude towards customers. If this were truly so, I would have cut off accepting comments on this thread about 5 months ago. However, we care enough to take the bad with the good and so thus this response.

The truth is that we passionately care about our customers and try to keep you/them pleased at every turn. The reality is that we haven't in the case of AVC HD.

While I'm disappointed that you've chosen to move to Final Cut for your editing, I understand that they provide an answer that you need now. Fortunately, Adobe is most likely still a part of your overall work with products like After Effects and Photoshop. Production Premium is unique in that it's not a question of either Adobe or Apple, but hopefully Adobe or Apple+Adobe.

As for the implication that we are not innovating like Apple, I would point out Dynamic Link as one example of unique solutions that the competition doesn't or can't do. What about client review? Clip Notes.

What about DVC Pro HD or XD Cam EX? With Apple, both of these are rewrapped or transcoded to be conformed to QuickTime. Not so in Adobe Premiere Pro - it's native MXF with no metadata stripped.

While the above may mean nothing to your business and I can understand that, it hopefully makes it clear that Adobe has and will continue to innovate to create solutions that are compelling to our customers. With any luck, we'll get the opportunity to win you back. Until then, Adobe and I will keep trying. ;-)

Thanks again for your comments. DR]

have (had) the same problem here! tried to use cs3 with avchd for month but adobe gives a s..t! i can´t wait for the next 5 month or for cs4 what will cost me a lot of money just for avchd because i was happy with cs3 and i do not need anything else. changed to pinacle studio and … what can i say, it works perfect. by by adobe! i think adobe lost many customers and will loose even more prosumers in the next month if they a) don´t implement avchd in cs3 or b) just implement it in cs4. i can´t understand adobe here! hey you can´t tell people it is important for adobe and “we are working on it” an this for 5 or more month! other companies can do that i 1-2 month! by by adobe!

I recently purchased the Sony SR-11. I think AVCHD will only become more popular with time in the consumer market.

I am a long time Adobe User, but I am thinking about Vegas Pro, but have held out because I am familiar with Adobe, and Pro supposedly takes a lot of time to learn.

I am hesistant to install and use Pinnacle Studio 11.

I guess like others, just waiting for CS4 to catch up with my camera.

Just for a moment lets forget about where AVC HD or even whether AVC HD, can you give any indication of
when for CS4?
Gerald

[DR - Not if I value my job.

Since Adobe is a publicly traded company, disclosure of such information is never discussed, so sadly I will never discuss such information. Thanks for your comment.]

How about when can we register for alph or beta
particapation>

[DR - I put an idea to the Premiere team, and waiting to hear back. You can request features for Premiere Pro by emailing premierewishlist[removeme]@adobe.com]

more and more prosumer avchd camcorders come on the market and adobe still has no information about when avchd is implemented in cs3? wow i mean i use adobe product over serveral years but thats a complete mess! and there is no official statement of adobe?? that can´t be true! as written herer more and more adobe users are afraid is it implementet only in cs4 and if so i think adobe will loose many prosumer costomers and me too! it can´t be so hard and you say you are “working on it” for over 4 month??? come on to be honest if some people are working hard for nearly half a year on this and there is no feedback at all… adobe is annoying its costomers thats for shure. and there will be more and more avchd comcorders out the next month (canon hf10/100, samsung SC-HMX20C etc…). and i´m a mac user so mainconcept has no mac plugin for me too! tell me how i should work with the avchd files on a mac? i don´t understand adobe here at all… for me it looks like they want to hold it back for cs4 and nothing else and thats a shame because i spent thousands of dollars on your products and now i get really poor support. so if it´s not in cs3 will sell my PP CS3 and go for another editing programm thats for shure.

[DR - Stephan, we have publicly stated that we will support AVC HD. The bit about Main Concept is true, though there are work arounds there as well which I'm checking to see if I can officially publish. Therein lies part of the problem - we need a solution that is cross platform. If we wanted to support our PC customers only, we could simply license Main Concept or others. however, we are committed to both platforms and all customers, so with that comes additional choices.

If AVC HD ends up in CS4, it is not because we're holding back, plain and simple. It is one of timing and execution. There are many priorities and they are mapped against engineering efforts. Some are harder than others. Some require dependencies on other companies, etc. etc. ad nauseum.

Thank you for your comments and I hope that this provides some clarity to our desire to satisfy all of our customers including you. Cheers, DR]

Just got a Canon HF10 a few weeks ago (not as flexible as my Panasonic DVX100, but does a pretty good job for a tiny, tiny camera). Naturally, ran into the AVCHD problem with PP CS3. Tried a few low cost solutions, and have settled on Shedworx Voltaic utility ($30) to handle transcoding. Unfortunately, getting things from AVCHD to WMV is slow, slow, slow — about 18 seconds of processing on a relatively modern machine for 1 second of output. Hopefully when Adobe gets its act in order and implements AVCHD on PP, we won’t see a bit performance hit (otherwise, transcoding really will be the only viable option for folks who don’t have high-end hardware).

Great to see Sony XDCAM support popping up as an update!

How would a Canon HF10 owner take advantage of this?

[DR - Again, it since it is an AVC HD camera (or is it AVCHD {no space]) there are options, but nothing that is native with Premiere Pro at the moment. You can try downloading Panasonic’s AVCHD to P2 transcoder software as one possible free option. The other that I like is buying a Blackmagic Design Intensity card and feeding the HDMI from the camera to the card. You can capture using BMDs jpeg codec I think and have a reasonable solution there as well. With the BMD option, you negate the editing of long GOP MPEG. Hope this helps and thanks for the comment.]

Hi Dennis

Please forgive my cheekiness, but fortune (sometimes) favours the brave.

If/when Adobe support ACV HD for CS3, please let me know if you need a beta tester? >9o)

Kind regards

Rod Davies (UK)

P.S. Last year I was given a quick tour / intro at Adobe Amsterdam when I was visiting my vendor (Stream) in the same building – are you based there?

[DR - Rod, I am based in the US and simply wishing I had a chance to do a small amount of international travel. I believe I will have a chance to visit England before too long. As far as being a beta tester, I will look into how you might apply. I will send you an email.]

Ok, I’ve noticed comments since the start of NAB have slowed dramatically – this is somewhat ominous. I just got a second hand report from a friend of mine at the show who walked to the Adobe booth and asked about AVCHD support. He said their response was:

“AVCHD is a consumer format which cannot really be used in serious production TV or film. Adobe only plans to support this in their consumer products.”

Comments, anyone? I assume “comsumer products” means Premiere Elements, and rules out support in Premiere Pro (at least in CS3). Is the silence on this BLOG a fear to reveal this policy to the ridicule it will inevitably generate? Or is this a case of someone misquoting (or mishearing) Adobe’s stance on AVCHD?

[DR - Dan, this is an easy one for me. AVC HD will be in Premiere Pro and not just our consumer products. See, no fear. ;-)]

This is truly amazing. Adobe is truly leading the game with RAW images and PShop’s converter, but with a leading format like AVCHD (my Canon HG10) you’re not there yet, and I have to weasel information about this widespread format out of Adobe through a single forum thread? FWIW, Ulead 11.5 seems to work fine and gives me basic-level AVCHD editing and output functions, so that’s were I just put my money. Really hope Adobe can get going on this ASAP.

Add us to the list of those waiting for XDCam EX support.
Now Sony has announced the PMW- EX3, the SECOND generation of this camera, and still Adobe has no support for the format.
Admitedly, we’ve been forced to use Sony Vegas, as the 3rd party ‘solutions’ from the two major 3rd party vendors, are unstable, buggy, and outragiously-expensive. One of these breaks the workflow and well, we may as well be shooting on tape again with that alternative workflow. The other offers a lot of baggage that we already own licenses for, so it’s 3/5ths wasted money for duplicate features.

Since the new cams from Sony are so good, we’re considering a move to the Mac platform and Final Cut Pro. In fact, we’re supposed to have a meeting about it later this month.

That would be a shame, as we’ve been staunch supporters of Adobe Premiere since 2001.

I do hope Adobe corrects this very soon!

[DR - Thanks for your comments Mark. I've been impressed with what I've seen on XDCAM EX so far, but I'm no expert. XDCAM is based on the MXF platform and NAB starts tomorrow, so maybe you'll see something.]

I’m a casual user who just bought an AVCHD format camcorder. I have Premiere and figured it would naturally work with my new camera. I was surprised, much like the others in this thread, to find that Adobe doesn’t have an update for it. Then I went looking for why and came upon this site. What a shock. The original article was posted on November 19, 2007 and now almost 5 months later there is no more valuable information on the support for this format as there was in November. Instead, the replies to customer pleas and complaints is a lighthearted but repetitive message: We don’t have any idea as to when or how we’ll provide support. But we’re working on it.

It is amazing that a software company hasn’t even disclosed even a general timeline for support or given any insight into what stage of development they are at in supporting this format. You have heard of project and release management?

In the end, I really don’t care when or if Adobe provides the support because what came with the camera is sufficient for me. What is surprising to me is how gullible Adobe must think their customers to be to keep telling them the same thing for 5 months without official insight.

[DR - Eric, oi vei...

I can't talk about general time lines because project and release management can be a fluid thing as you should know since you purport to know these things. The fact that I say we're working on it should give our customers confidence that Adobe understands their needs. It is certainly better than nothing at all. Also, letting people express their comments (like yours) is an acknowledgment as opposed to sticking our heads in the sand.

Ultimately, I want an informed customer who is aware of the issues and I will tell you plainly that Adobe respects our customers in the highest sense as has been demonstrated throughout our 25 year history and we will continue to do so. Without the respect and support of our customers, we're out of business plain and simple.

Granted, I don't have AVC HD support in the time frame you want (me either for that matter), but to categorically say Adobe doesn't respect their customers or isn't listening or is...whatever you're trying to say...is a gross generalization and exaggeration.]

Hello,

I really like the atmosphere of this long list of comments! I’ve been tracking this page for months now, since it seems to be the only place on the web to get a little insight on Adobe and AVCHD! I’m really surprised that Adobe do not officially communicate on this topic, but anyway, I used other products to “try” and edit my own rushes, and I can tell (to emphasize your last comment) I’ll definitively go back to Premiere as soon as it manages AVCHD.
Thanks for giving us some hope!

[DR - see guys, I'm not making it all up! ;-) thanks for the comment Emmanuel.]

I have been using adobe premiere products for many years, but as a medical professional, I cannot understand Adobe’s lack of foresight and resource allocation to the AVCHD format. If we, as doctors, acted on the outbreaks of disease in the same fashion as your company, pandemics would be rampant across the globe. Adobe’s lack of action is deplorable and I agree it is likely only a marketing drive for future CS4 sales. Sorry to say, but after having been burned for so long with the lack of AVCHD support, I am forever leaving what used to be a fine company and moving onto other more progressive companies like Adobe used to be. You and your execs really missed the boat on this one at what I believe the expense will be the loss of thousands of former customers.

[DR - Dear doctor, aren't you being a little melodramatic by comparing pandemics with software development?

Truth be told, customers were saying the same thing about Panasonic P2/MXF until we delivered a GREAT solution that is better than the competition. Then it wasn't a big deal.

One other thing that I may not have mentioned thus far is that customer demand drives our development and P2 far outstripped AVCHD when it came down the pike. That's not to diminish anything or the problem we currently face, but it serves to illustrate that we're listening to customers and responding - P2 and other features just came ahead of AVCHD. We'll look to rectify that as soon as possible.

As I've said in other replies, I would rather deliver a solution a little later and it be superior than rush something to market just to say we have it. In the end, customers will be happier.

To close with the same analogy, wouldn't you rather have the right medicine than guess which one will work? Thanks for your comments - I do appreciate them.]

When will Premiere be compatible with Sony’s XDCAM EX PWM-EX1? I’ve been using premiere with Sony HVR-Z1E but when I wanted to upgrade to disc-recording i found out that Premiere has let me down… Can anyone give me a releasedate?

[DR - aye carumba! Let's throw on the RED Camera, AVC Intra and a few other formats... hit me when I'm down! ;-)

All kidding aside, I do know something about this - see, there I've said it! BUT, I can't say anything. This answer is perhaps even worse, but I will hang on to my integrity and tell you information as soon as I can!

And before I get bombed again on the AVCHD front the answer is, "I don't know!"

Your editor in arms: weary, beaten, bloody and tempted to close this thread, but still going with a smile...
DR]

Hi Dennis

Thanks for your patience and civility on what is certainly a hot topic – I am sure Adobe will bring focus to this increasing amount of feedback, but (as you can see) we feel very strongly that to retain customer satisfaction/loyalty (and no doubt future upgrade business) that Adobe hopefully address this as a free update for CS3 – the investment for some of us to get this far has not been inconsiderable..

Having just purchased a Sony HDR-SR12E (fantastic product), I finally found this thread – unfortunately the Panasonic Transcoder does not work for me (at least at 1920×1080) – has anyone else had any success?

Nero 8 when saving via Nero Vision either limits codec resolution to DV (for example .avi), or if you use MPEG-2, although it supports 1920x1080i, the conversion is poor, and it also seems to break the file up into segments and then drop frames between them. Again if anyone has had any success here, please let me know?

I have also received Pinnacle 11 as a birthday gift but have held off on installing it on my PC with Adobe CS3 Master Collection – it feels a bit embarassing to be turning to this, but i’m concerned that having two video editors may cause potential conflict based upon previous experience – does anyone else use Pinnacle 11 for AVCHD?

Kind regards

Rod Davies (UK)

[DR - Rod, thanks for your comments. I actually worked for Pinnacle for many years and keep bumping into friends who have moved on to other companies.

The transcoder software should be working for you - what's not working? Perhaps it is the classic Sony vs. Panasonic? that's something I haven't played around with...

PS - I hope to make my first visit to the UK later this summer!]

I’ve just started looking at buying a new camera and thus have been reading up on AVCHD which led me to this thread.

What a different world the Premiere side of Adobe is from the Coldfusion/Flash/Flex world that I normally work in. Those Adobe products are increasingly more open about what’s coming in future versions. By now everyone knows many of the main features coming in Flash CS4, the Flex Framework is open source and Coldfusion actively involves it’s community in future development. By comparison reading Adobe’s stance on something that when it’s ready should be a free upgrade for Premiere is a rather old school experience. This is the Adobe I knew before Macromedia’s community driven teams became part o the company. I was hoping this would have filtered over into other aspects of Adobe, but apparently not.

This is a major thing that based on the comments in this thread has burned a lot of loyal Adobe customers. To not be transparent about what the Premiere team is working on and to not at least hint at release time frames is just not appropriate in this day and age.

Go talk to the product management teams for all the former MM products, the rest of Adobe still has a lot to learn from them.

[DR - Unfortunately, I've got to head out today and behind on my comments, but in an effort to keep up, I'm responding rather briefly today...

I would respectfully disagree with your assessment. We published Premiere Pro and After Effects CS3 as public betas on Mac and PC the last time around and with NAB around the corner you might see something like it coming. P2 support is something we absolutely could have charged for but we didn't - it was completely free and I would expect more of the same to come from us in the future.

While I am sometimes constrained in what can be said, I try to be as straightforward as I can and will continue to do so as I represent the company.

To briefly speak on Adobe and Macromedia's cultures - they are coming together and both have learned a great deal from the others. To close, I will say that the public betas I alluded to earlier were a direct result of Macromedia's prior policy.]

This issue is way too big to generate this little information. That in itself provides the obvious answer; AVCHD support will be used to drive sales of CS4. Of course DR is not allowed to trump the Press Release / kickoff announcement soon to come. I commend him for holding his finger in the dike for so long. As for a free CS3 upgrade? ’nuff said.

You all know AVCHD support won’t be in CS3. You will need to purchase CS4.

Having just purchased a Canon HG10, my need for AVCHD support in PP CS3 has shot up. I’d also like to see support for it in After Effects CS3 as well! Is there an email notification list I can get on to be notified when the support arrives (any day now)??

[DR - As of right now Dan, I don't know of anything specific for Adobe Premiere Pro or After Effects. However, any major new features are going to get their press from Adobe and elsewhere, so I would recommend that you get signed up on Adobe's general email list. It sends out a monthly (we try not to spam you) list with a bunch of news and resources.]

I thought Adobe Premiere was the best solution for video editing until we bought it and realized there was no AVCHD support. This led us to research other products and buy something else, but Adobe should have already known this would happen.

Has anybody tried the Main Concept AVCHD-to-P2 transcoder (distributed free for use with Panasonic products) with files from the Canon HF10?
As many others, I am looking for a way to edit AVCHD with Premiere.

[DR - I've posted a comment on this before I think. It is a viable workaround and one that is absolutely free. The only downside is larger file sizes. ]

I’ve had an AVCHD camcorder for over 15 months now. Every month or so I keep coming back to Adobe to see if/when support for the format may be coming. That’s a long, long time to be waiting.

While I continue to keep waiting, I still see the same vague comments I saw all those months ago: “No stated position, we’re working on it, it takes a long time, development resources”. Adobe expressed support for the AVCHD format back in July 2006. Pfft.

I’ve been using Adobe Premiere for editing videos since version 5.5 through CS3, and I’ve always found its features the most complete and best organized. Now I’m planning to buy a AVCHD camcorder, and hope you’ll have the support for the format soon. I understand it takes time and effort to provide a high-quality solution, but please give it a priority – as you see in this thread, it is important to many users of your software!

[DR - This much I CAN tell you - It's a TOP priority! Thanks for your comments.]

Firstly, thanks for providing this page. It’s saved us a great deal of time in looking for a solution and understanding why we can open the format with adobe products.
We wanted to add some video testimonials to our website so got a Sony Handycam hoping to use it with the CS3 software. We’re using Vegas Movie Studio at the moment but eagerly awaiting adobe to support the format. We only use the Vegas software to convert the movies into a suitable format and then use the adobe software. The results we are getting into Flash and onto the web are fine for our needs but it will be much easier when the format is supported. Looking forward to seeing it soon.
It’s nice to see so many comments from DR, many would have lost their patience by now! Keep up the good work.

[DR - Thanks for the kind words - it helps keep me commenting on a prickly issue!]

Although I appreciate that you have to be tight-lipped about future updates and releases of Adobe’s software, my growing concern for future work-flow is more important to me. AVCHD is the direction one of my new clientele wants to go, for the sake of ease of use and end user, Flash Media makes so much more sense than HDV or other Tape based formats. It is the ultimate reusability.

[DR - agreed, which is why we invested so much time in developing a best-of-class tapeless workflow. At this time though, it is just for Panasonic P2.]

It would seems as though you have been leading us to believe Adobe will announce something in conjunction with NAB. Hopefully that is the case, but I have already lost potential income waiting for the right fix to come along. Now I agree that I would rather have just that, the “right” fix, rather than a band aid, hodge podge version.

[DR - I am not leading you to believe anything about NAB or otherwise. I am trying to address comments in a fairly timely manner for the better understanding of our customers.

One note in this long stream of comments -t here are some workarounds right now including Panasonics utility to convert AVCHD to P2. Granted it is NOT a perfect solution, but hey, that's why they call it a workaround! BTW - I'm NOT being flippant, just trying to put some humor in a humorless thread.]

I do think it is fair for Adobe Premiere Pro users to criticize Adobe. It isn’t that we mind Adobe could possibly be behind other competitors. It is that they are leading us on without adequate information. Just tell us, point black, we are working on it, and a planned date, or expected date. That and how much if anything it will cost current CS3 owners.

[DR - I never said otherwise about our customers stating their opinions. As for information, I am not in a position to comment as clearly as I would like - simple as that.]

We shell out a lot of money for what we believe to be a superior solution, we deserve to have a little insider information. Without us, Adobe Premiere Pro is nothing.

[DR - thanks for your comments.]

Dennis,
Let me start by saying I applaud you for a taking so many forms of heat and using different (not canned) responses for each person’s question(s).

Yes, I believe Adobe will eventually support AVCHD, but as a smalltime studio who just took the plunge on an HDR-SR12, I’m beginning to feel like I’ve made a mistake in my purchase.

[DR - I've just heard that we've made a little progress with Sony about getting that specific camera into my hands at some point! And now we return to our regularly scheduled comments...]

My question is a simple one. I realize you can’t give release dates, and maybe this is that type of question from a different angle, but…

Can you AT LEAST tell us whether this will be a free update to current CS2/3 users, or will we have to upgrade?

[Marc, I don't know - I really don't. We've recently added Panasonic's P2 support absolutely free of charge and that was huge, but I can't say if we'll absolutely do the same for all codecs. In some cases, it is a licensing issue.]

I can stand not having AVCHD support (but I realize others can’t) for now, but would want to know I don’t have shell out a few more bills to get that support.

Thanks, and keep up the responses. It’s not very often we get questions answered in this fashion.

-Marc

[DR - thanks for the comments, I'll keep trying hard for both Adobe and my customers.]

Well, first, sorry for the long post. I’m a prosumer user and find a lot of comfort in knowing I’m not alone in my disatisfaction with adobe as a company. For my 9-5 job, I work in a very large corporate environment (not unlike Adobe). I have some serious problems with DR’s answers from Adobe. If what he is saying is true, then only two things are possible.

[DR - no prob with the long post - you took the time to write it, so I'll try to answer some of statements.]

#1: senior management is incompetent and doomed to suffer a “re-org.” following the loss in marketshare from these poor decisions. (You corporate types know what I mean.) Your pride in NOT being “first to market” with the AVCHD format support is purely defensive. If you had the technology and foresight, you would have been marketing the pants off of it. It would be plastered all over your spec sheet. There are now several major manufacturers that record in AVCHD format (not just Sony anymore).

[DR - I actually like our senior management team a lot and to be honest re-orgs happen regardless of competency or not! ;-) I stand by my statement about not being first to market as a potential plus as evidenced by two recent examples I've already mentioned: tapeless workflows (P2) and multi-camera editing. A current problem with AVCHD is that it is VERY difficult to edit for the same reasons that MPEG2 was - temporal based codecs. As for multiple AVCHD types, you're right and my understanding (perhaps incorrect!) is that there are nuances in how they implement it. Think of HDV and MXF as two other examples where companies but heads...PS - I'm definitely NOT a corporate type, though I wouldn't mind their pay scale!]

This thread is now over 4 months old and there is STILL no solution. You can visit any local electronics retailer today and this is your best option. Sure, Adobe doesn’t necessarily cater to the consumer market, but today, that is a suicidal coporate/marketing decision. You will easily have over twice the number of consumer users in the market than pro with current pricing trends on the technology. I could quite easily walk in to my local retailer, buy the best HD camera off the shelf, which will coincidentally record in AVCHD currently, then walk two aisles over and put my hands on a software solution to edit it. Checkout, take them home and all will work fine. Adobe is nowhere in this scenario and should be ashamed of themselves. I have decided to wait on my premiere upgrade and now I’m quite sure that there is no point. I can start editing footage tonight with software off the shelf from a different company. Granted I won’t have all the features and power of Premiere, but I will be able to work and be productive.

[DR - granted the thread is 4 months old, but engineering doesn't happen when we'd like it to. As a guy who has been tied to product management for over 10 years, I can tell you that I'm disappointed 9 times out of 10 with my requests. 4 months may sound like an extravagantly long time, but the reality is that it isn't. ]

#2: SDK. hogwash. That is a total cop-out. Regarding lack of resources, again I call hogwash. Any company as large as Adobe, that has the capital to acquire other companies like flash/dreamweaver can easily throw the equivalent of pocket change at R&D to develop the software support plugin. While it is a nice gesture, to wear it as a shield is insulting to the customer base. You can spin it all you want, but what the customer base HEARS is: “we do not see the value in providing the solution to YOUR problem.” Or, “we are too lazy to develop the solution and recommend that you
a) buy our software,
b) buy the upgrades and then
c) go buy a third party solution for what has become a “common” standard.
Adobe has a responsibility to provide support for formats considered mainstream. SDK is best used to answer fringe issues or niche markets. AVCHD is clearly NOT a niche standard anymore.

[DR - Well Mark, I guess we have to agree to disagree - I believe in the value of a SDK and a 3rd party community, it's obvious that you don't. 'nuff said. ]

Now don’t get me wrong. I’m no screaming fan of the AVCHD format. I hardly know anything about it. My argument is a matter of principle. If this is becoming mainstream, Adobe has a self-preserving interest to include support for it. On a personal note, I’ve always found other products to be easier to use in some aspects like capture, but have learned to use Premiere for it’s powerful editing features. I love it and would love to take it with me on my journey into HD but it appears that Adobe is going to oversleep and miss the boat altogether.

Speaking of arrogance and not to force you to be defensive, but just to echo the “voice of the customer”, this is now the second recent experience I’ve had with Adobe where I’m left feeling like I’m not valued as a customer. My first experience has been with upgrade cost. I called to inquire about upgrading from Pro 1.5 to 2.0/CS3. I was amazed to hear (and very “matter-of-factly”) that the upgrade cost is the same for me (who keeps up with the upgrades) as it is for the person who hasn’t stayed current and is many, many versions old. You could have a version 5 premiere and upgrade to CS3 for the same cost as me who already spent considerable more money keeping current. I think this too is a foolish move for Adobe and the way the sales dept. handled me only re-assures my thinking.

[DR - If you were a customer who skipped a version as you may be now ;-), you would view our upgrade policy differently. Our position is that we do not want to penalize customers for missing a version. They have invested in us and consequently we want to give them an easy way to remain with Adobe products. The glass is half full for me, my friend.]

I hope for Adobe’s sake they get re-energized about the value of their customers or there will surely be far fewer of them to worry about. There are far too many other products available that will answer our needs. Sorry again for the rant.

Mark

[DR - Mark, thanks again. I hear and sympathize with your frustration. Trust me, I'm taking these comments back to product management and we're not sitting idly by letting our customers get upset. However, I do not have an answer that everyone wants right now, so consequently, I do what I can by answering here. Trust me, Adobe cares about our customers and we ARE energized and can only hope to become even more so as we hear about what we can and should be doing to support you. Thanks for your comments.]

I, like several on this forum, have been a long time user of Photoshop & Premier; recently purchased a Sony SR12 AVCHD HandyCam..and love it..then I discovered no non-linear editing capabilities for the AVC format..tried the Main Concept plug-in..too slow for real-time previews and I have a high-end system; gave Vegas a quick look but just don’t want to learn another video editing program; so now my hopes are with Adobe..I’m sure I’ll have to pay another $299 for a CS4 upgrade but I guess I don’t have another choice..
I hope its soon but would rather wait for something that isn’t slow & kludgy and doesn’t work woth dual-core processors..

[DR - I agree that I would rather have a solution that works right than something that says 'yes I have AVCHD, and under delivers. Thanks for the comment.]

Hi,

i´m really dissapointed! I bought the master collection cs month ago. More and More Cams use the AVCHD format and adobe says they are working for month to get it fixed…hmmm i don´t believe this any more and that´s a shame! i won´t by the update to cs4 to get the AVCHD support! and this is what a lot of people think here. i think adobe will loose many users on this and why the hell is nobody really working on this?? there is no status, no timeline, no release date…nothing! i think it will be implemented in cs4 and not a free update for cs3. then i´m going to sell my adobe stuff and turn to FC Pro…It can´t be so hard to get this working…the other companys can do that to!

Well I’ve just read through the blog and I do appreciate DRs dedication to keep us informed in what is an obvious stretch of his legal obligation to keep lips sealed.

While I can conclude that you are indeed working on this issue now and urgently can you either confirm or deny that this will be a CS3 update?

When it boils down to it, that is what matters to me as I too have hastily purchased cs3. If you can’t say either way, then please just let us know that.

It will be very disappointing if a CS3 update is not planned. However, with the latest release of AVCHD cameras (including my brand new Sony SR12 which supports full 1920×1080) I can’t see why this would not be profitable to maximise Adobe’s market by including a CS3 update to extend its life before the next major x.0 upgrade.

Thanks for your time DR, while frustrating as it is, (and woah – yes it is :) lots of us appreciate your efforts in bringing us what you can in a such a confidential area as software development.

For the rest of you understand that software companies can’t release info until they know what they are going to do and how it will work. If they are only working it out, it will be some time away…

p.s the plugin link up top no longer works.

[DR - Dan thanks for your understanding and comments. Trust me as frustrating as it is for you, it is ten times more for me since I have to take the heat as part of my commitment to maintaining this blog and the customer's voices.

To your important question...Simply put, I can't comment on whether it is a CS3 update or a part of a future release. I wish it were otherwise, but that's the facts.

Lastly, I am trying (glutton for punishment that I am) to put together another post that outlines all of the working solutions with Adobe and AVCHD. I hope to put it up before NAB, but my schedule has been crazy.

Thanks again.]

Alrighty, I bought 2 Sony HDR SR1′s January 2006. I found after i bought them that AVCHD wouldn’t be something I could edit with Pro 2.0. but I knew that CS3 was coming soon and there was a lot of talk about it being supported. It seemed logical that Adobe would support and crazy if they didn’t, which they didn’t so this has gotten crazy. I want to know, is there going to be a free fix for this ever????? Or are more and more people going to have give up on Adobe?

Why doesn’t everyone just use Sony Vegas Pro? It is great and supports AVCHD and costs less.

I work at a software company that has a total of 300 people. I don’t care what you say but if AVCHD is such a huge priority should it not have a estimated release date? Come on be real with us.

I know exactly when ADOBE will support AVCHD. It will be the same day CS4 is released.

I got tired of waiting and moved to Sony Vegas and I am glad I did. I have been following this thread since it started and had to voice my opinion.

Go buy Sony Vegas. Also, I do not work for Sony. I use a Canon HG10 for recording and Vegas to edit.

Please don’t give me a reason to move from Photoshop to GIMP.

Just be honest and open that’s all we want.

For some time I was able to use NERO 7.0′s Premiere Pro Plug-in of NeroDigital to encode AVC HD then burn a DVD 9 with NERO to get up to one hour HD. The new NERO 8.0 does not work the same way. Do you, or other contributers, have a simple work around? Of course I am talking about using a 1080i preset and not working in the AVC HD native format.

I’m just starting out in editing and from my research found that Premiere Pro was the NLE of choice for me. Then I learned that it didn’t support AVCHD in which my camcorder records. Reading this thread makes me realize that maybe I won’t be able to use Premiere and will have to go elsewhere. But I’ll download a trial version of Vegas Pro and see if Adobe makes AVCHD a compatible CODEC.

It has been 2 years since Sony released its first AVCHD Camera.

It has been close to a year since most of the major compeitors to adobe have had full support for AVCHD.

Adobe’s lack of support for this codec is ridiculous, and if they make it a CS4 feature instead of a CS3 update it will be the last straw for many customers here.

This codec has been around since 2006 and still no news from Adobe, not even a release date.

Why because Adobe has no plans to support it. My advice to anyone looking to work with AVCHD footage is to forget about looking at adobe as an option for their editing software purchase and use one of the several programs out there that already fully support it.

You guys are as big as apple and canonical and if they can push out a new version of OSX or Ubuntu every year and set release dates 12months in advance of their actual release then there is no reason why adobe cant. Unless of course adobe have no plans of ever supporting this codec, which is in this case highly likely.

I got to give it to adobe though, they have a lot of nerve trying to knowingly suck in new customers who will never be supported by their software. Its a hell of a nice way to boost profits though.

Dennis might be able to prove me wrong by posting a release date, but I doubt this will ever happen.

[DR - David, I'm pushing this up on the website because I believe that our customers should have a voice. That being said, I thought twice about publishing this. Here's some thoughts:

1) You're making suppositions that are not factual. You're expressing your opinion as fact. while I respect your opinion you should state it as such.
2) the length of this thread itself should be a testament to my personal commitment to communicating to everyone. It should also speak to Adobe's commitment to supporting codecs in general. Please read all of my detailed responses before you post again - I've outlined several things in my responses.
3) We're not as big as Apple or Canon from a market valuation, but I appreciate the compliment. However, I get your point: the fact is that we are a big software company. Because we're big doesn't necessarily mean we have unlimited resources. It makes me paraphrase the Orsen Welles line when he was reduced to selling Gallo wine, "How do you think we got so big?" The answer my friend is that we try to make as many smart decisions as possible.

We're not perfect as you will quickly point out, but we care about our customers, otherwise we wouldn't be here.

'nuff said...

PS - love your email address - really!]

At the moment I’m using Pinnacle studio 11 Ultimate for AVCHD video editing. It works well. I had several versions of Premiere before(5.1 being the first one), and there is nothing like it. Like all the other people in this blog I would like the AVCHD support in Premiere.
The top entry in this blog is from November. We are now 5 months later, and still no news. I have worked with software writers, and trust me, if I had to wait 5 months, I would have been fired, and they would have been also.
For your customers, there is little else they can do than wait (and complain), or most likely buy another software package, like I did. Now Adobe should really hope that the other software packaged are not really good, otherwise they will not be returning customers.

I wish you all the best in getting the AVCHD support sorted, and let us both hope it will not take too long. (Any news??)

Best regards
Frans

[DR - Frans and all, Thanks for your continued comments. I truly appreciate your support, comments and commitment to Adobe in taking the time to write. And no, I'm not buttering your bread or just saying that - I really do...

It's been several months since the original post and this particular entry still gets a lot of reads every day (perhaps because it comes to the top of a "Adobe AVC" search on Google... ;-) This is indicative of how important it is to people.

However, that being said, I have no real update at this time other than to let you know that it is one of the top issues that we're working on. Really working on...hard...very hard...

While this won't placate you in any way, let me just say that if Adobe could wave a magic wand and make this format appear, it would, but it is not that easy. Consider that we rolled out Panasonic P2 support several months after shipping Production Premium. We were getting yelled at to support that too. Plus, we have RED camera guys that want us to support them. We have Sony XDCamEX guys that want us to support them. While you're at it, throw in XDCamHD and SD as well. The list goes on - imagine all of you multiplied by all of the current formats out there... ahh!!!

These aren't excuses, far from it, but I am taking the time again to help you understand whats involved and that Adobe is constantly evaluating many customer segments at once and making choices. Let me be clear as well - AVC HD is VERY important to us.

With AVC HD, part of our process is understanding the best workflow to make this a pleasurable and effective experience. With Long GOP codecs, the process can be difficult as we found out with MPEG2. AVC HD is very hard to decode, edit and playback with effects in real-time unless you have a top-of-the-line system. This is part of what we're working on right now.

So, after all of this, perhaps the above is an update after all. I hope that you guys/gals know we 'get it' and we'll 'get it' to you as soon as possible. Thanks.

Dennis]

I have resited but it’s time for a mac. Be sure to get Leopard operating system if you want avchd import to imovie. Final cut pro is what everyone in Hollywood uses anyway. Whenever I say I use CS3, the people here in Hollywood look at me like I have 2 heads.

Regards,
Nadia Valentine

[DR - Nadia, you've got a lot in here, but I'm going to answer with succinctness (hopefully! ;-)

Mac - that's great. I use a Mac all of the time. A key advantage to ALL users is CHOICE which is what some of the original intent of this post was about. Apple is a platform choice and Avid is a hardware choice. Adobe is software that is available on either platform.

Leopard - if you read amongst professionals, you'll quickly learn that Leopard has had a significant issues thus far. Throw in Quicktime and you have a recipe for trouble. So, I can't necessarily recommend Leopard right now.

FCP in Hollywood - I actually asked our hollywood guy to respond to this but I'll take a crack at this. Avid, Apple and Adobe all have presences in Hollywood. Avid is clearly #1 right now and there is a solid amount of FCP out there as well. BUT to say that Adobe isn't involved in hollywood would be a mistake.

http://www.adobe.com/cfusion/showcase/index.cfm?event=finder&productid=101025&loc=en_us

The above is a good place to start. Here's one on a major motion picture...

http://www.adobe.com/cfusion/showcase/index.cfm?event=casestudydetail&casestudyid=114473&loc=en_us

In short, Adobe products including After Effects, Photoshop, and Premiere Pro are in Hollywood today. A question for me would be what does AVC HD and Hollywood have in common? Do you think AVC HD will be a tool for independent film?

I hope this helps provide clarity to you and readers in general. Of course, this still doesn't address the lack of AVCHD(!) but as I've said, we're aware of the problem and working on it.

Thanks for your comments.]

I purchased my Sony HDR-SR1 1 year and 4 months ago. I’ve been very frustrated with the lag for AVCHD support from higher end video editors such as premier. I’ve had to downgrade much of my video to get projects completed and others are piling up into a backlog of work. What is the holdup? I know you can’t tell us when but out of pure frustration with the lack of information let me just say, lets get on the stick Adobe. If Premier’s support for AVCHD were an egg it would be so far beyond its due date it would be stinking to high heaven.

It’s really insane that a professional piece of software like Adobe Premiere (and After Effects for that mather) doesn’t support AVCHD.

I have to do some insane transcoding or use a crippled shareware plugin to get basic file format support.

Go ahead Adobe, treat your customers the same way Creative treats it’s customers. And face the same consequences. Pinnacle, Sony Vegas, Final Cut Pro are all starting to sound like good alternatives.

I haven’t got an HD camcorder but I do have a sony DVD DC505 camcorder that shoots to DVD. It creates mpeg files on the DVDs. I bought Adobe production Premier Pro studion so that I could edit and teach editing vedio to my students. The book says that CS3 supports mpeg but after 2 months of trying everthing we can think of, we haven’t be able to import or capture any of it to edit. Whats wrong?

[DR – I doublechecked with my tech support and verified what I thought. Your camcorder does record MPEG2 but as a VOB (video object). Basically, you can do one of two things: Get Premiere Elements, which will natively read the VOB (part of the DVD spec) or copy the VOB from your camera to your computer and rename the extension to .MPG and you should be able to edit it no problem in Premiere Pro.

Hope this helps you!}

This application software (made and supported by Panasonic) transforms AVCHD clips recorded by Panasonic cameras into DVCPRO HD format.

This enables users to edit the clips on non-linear editors ( Like Premier Pro CS3) which do not support AVCHD but do support DVCPRO HD.
Available format: 1080i 59.94 and 1080i 50 are supported.

Use this URL:

https://eww.pavc.panasonic.co.jp/pro-av/support/desk/e/download.htm#avchd

[DR - Thanks Robert. I actually want to do a post on this kind of workflow as a viable alternative until Adobe has something. I was aware of this, but your post has reminded me to get busy on this!!! Thanks.]

We just bought Adobe Creative Suite 3 Production Premium and I just installed it. I did not bother checking to see if it supported AVCHD. Adobe better not hold back AVCHD so it can be a CS4 feature.

Will AVCHD support ever be in CS3 or did we make a mistake buying CS3?

Hi DR.
I am absolutely stunned at this forum. Everyone, absolutely everyone wants to know when you will support it. We hear that you will… sometime, but it’s like holding our breath for who knows how long for. Break the ice and spill the beans. Seriously, this seems to be a joke!

[DR - Okay then Greg, here's the official statement (which you won't like): "Adobe does not comment on release dates of future products." See, I told you wouldn't like it. ;-) I'm saying this with a smile on my face, but sadly am not joking.

I understand everyones frustration which is why I conscientiously reply to each and every comment that shows up on this thread. I will reiterate that as soon as I have some more information that I can share, I absolutely will. I appreciate everyones patience.]

Hi there,

You must confess that this is a competitive market…
and Adobe is falling behind.
Not only do you not support AVC but have not provided a pathway for files generated by Sony’s new EX1.
The result is… I have to put in an enterprise system, and because you guys have dropped the ball, I have to go with FCP.
I really thought you guys were gonna be agressive with PPro…I guess not.

Mike

[DR - Mike, Thanks for your comments. I am surprised you wouldn't wait until NAB to make a decision like that.]

I think to some degree you are missing the point. Many of us cruise along for a version or two and then consider changing horses. I’ve been on PP for six years, roughly 150 broadcast programs. The answers you give reflect either arrogance or a lack of communication internally. I have just spent several hours taking another look at AVID. I would hate to see the very same characteristics that have cost them so dearly embed in the ADOBE family. This is a relationship built on trust. I think your approach ought to reflect you and your company’s efforts to generate the confidence for us to invest our time and hard earned money in your product.

[DR - Reid, thanks for your comments and I appreciate your point of view. However, I would respectfully disagree with your overall assessment, but please don't take that as any sign of arrogance.

My point here in taking the time to respond to all of these comments is to specifically give the information that I have and address our customers concerns. To give you confidence that YES we do know that this is something we have to address. However, we do not have a native solution right now.

I agree that if Adobe takes a position of arrogance then we are doomed to failure, but I do not see that anywhere within the organization. Adobe takes rightful pride in our products and how we have changed the creative community over the years with products like Photoshop, After Effects, Flash and Premiere Pro. However, we do not advance those products from a position of arrogance: we get excited about how we can dramatically change the product to make it better.

Finally, in closing let me say that we care very much about the customers we service and that we do everything we can to make sure that you can TRUST Adobe to continue to change how you think about and create media. Hopefully, we've earned your trust for just a little bit longer.]

“So, while some other companies are offering AVCHD solutions today, I can’t help but wonder what the actual editing experience is.”

I can’t help thinking that as someone in the business of talking about Premiere Pro you should probably try out the competition yourself rather than merely wondering.

Suffice it to say that I’m in the market for an affordable HD camera for my video show and I’m using Premiere Pro for editing. All the cameras I find most attractive (Canon HG10, Canon HF100 and so on) are AVCHD based. I’m frankly shocked that a professional grade product like Premiere Pro can’t handle a file format that seems to be becoming a defacto standard. I certainly didn’t pay over £700 for Premiere Pro only to have to spend hundreds more on a plug-in that will quickly become redundant.

So all my whining aside – I’ve not actually BOUGHT an AVCHD camea yet so I have a question – what cameras should be on my list? I need HD support and a mic connector. That’s about it. I’d like to spend somewhere in the region of £600. That means products around about the price of the Canon HG10. I’d go a little above that if there was good reason. And I don’t want tapes – tapes are SO last century! ;-)

John

[DR - John, good points and I agree. Unfortunately, I don't get all of the cameras to play with and in fact have yet to give one a spin. I plan to ask Sony for one of theirs in the near future. As for trying my competition, I agree again and I do play with other products as much as I can. Right now it's an issue of time and having a camera.

So, as of today, I cannot recommend a camera because I have not even played with one. My advice is to look into the various manufacturers and read some of the forums.

Thanks for your comments.]

I appreciate the work that Adobe is doing to try and bring the AVCHD format to us.

I’m using Production Premium CS3 and Premiere Elements on my laptop for basic projects that don’t need all the features. I would love to be able to use the format natively from my HDC-SD1.

That being said, is there any timetable yet on when Adobe might support this file format without a plug-in? I’m currently an Intensity pro for capture and using Nero to convert raw files from the card, but would honestly prefer a simpler work flow.

[DR - Travis, thanks for the comments. As to when we might add this functionality is something I can't comment on other than to say we're working on it and we want it as soon as you do! ;-)

One other comment about native AVCHD editing is that it is VERY cpu intensive. While many other solutions already have AVCHD editing on their marketing blurbs, the truth is that some of these are not very practical for the user. Our goal is to provide the best overall solution for the customer.

The Intensity card from Blackmagic Design is another very effective way to do AVCHD editing and one that I may not have mentioned previously. It's cost effective, gives you great resolution and avoids the CPU issue I mentioned. PLUS they have MAC drivers!]

It is an interesting turn of appeal when being so hugely valuable, inventive and productive as Adobe is can lead to displeasure when it does not maintain the pace in particular areas.

This is understandable. We grow to depend on the developer as a business partner.

I have CS3 Master collection and know that when Adobe do support AVCHD it will be the best place for my editing of it. This, even discounting Premier Pro’s prowess and simply because of the ease of use and integration of the other applications in Adobe’s stable.

The comments here have been made in good humour and taken that way; don’t see the above as censure.

The writing is on the wall however, AVCHD is big and it is pushed by large companies. It is big because it handles more data more cheaply. There will come a time even with focus on ‘professional’ formats that the alternative focus on lesser quality formats than AVCHD will downgrade the perception of applications.

Like others, I look forward to Adobe support with extreme eagerness.

[DR - Thanks for the comment Ian. I do appreciate your perspective.]

I have a Sony SR8E and totally support the comment of other frustrated Premiere users. I’d really appreciate an update when y9u have identified a cost effective work around and/or a timetable for inclusion within Premiere.

Many thanks in adavance

http://www.adobeforums.com/webx?14@@.3c052631/137 has some solutions: Mainsoft’s plug-in is reportedly slow (50% realtime), but Elecard’s Converter Studio will downconvert to HDV well. Also an Adobe lab forum thread I can’t get back to had an Adobe engineer recomending Black Magic’s Intensity PCI card HDMI in & out as a hardware alternative until CS3 support is added.

[DR - John, thanks for the comments. I'll try to chase down the link and read up on it. The Intensity solution is a viable solution and Steve Whatley (After Effects Cookbook blog) has recently done some testing and forwarded the results. He really likes the quality. I think the idea of transcoding or capturing in a different codec other than AVCHD may be a mainstream one despite our typical aversion to doing it. Admittedly, I still have to read up on the technical stuff of AVCHD more before I can really sink my teeth into it. Again, thanks for the post.]

What I don’t hear coming back from the Adobe guy is:
1. We are working on it
2. It will be out by ____
3. It will be a free update
Please give concrete responses?

[DR - Hi Brent..

1. We are working on it.
2 & 3. I don't know. See #1

I know this doesn't help much, but 'dems 'da facts.'

Let me bring up one additional point in this whole discussion not as a defense but as a perspective. Adobe has been last to add certain features several instances before including multicam editing, Panasonic P2 and others. However, in being last, we also brought the best overall solution to the market. With Multicam, we allow type of mixed footage or even a sequence to be a camera. Competitors can't do that. Panasonic P2 implementation is completely native - no rewrapping or transcoding necessary - a true digital file transfer from P2 card to hard drive. Or even edit off the card. Most competitors can't do that.

With AVCHD, it is extremely difficult to have a smooth editing experience because of some of the same issues that revolve around MPEG2. Do you want native or wait for a transcode? Data rates, storage space? Real-time performance? These are just some of the issues at stake here. So, while some other companies are offering AVCHD solutions today, I can't help but wonder what the actual editing experience is.

I know this probably only fuels the fire, but I'm trying to give as much information here as possible...

My hope is that Adobe will be able to bring to market a compelling editing experience that takes into account both the customers needs as well as the technical difficulties of dealing with a delivery style codec. Time will tell and I will certainly attempt to deliver information as it becomes available.

Thanks as always for all of the comments and keep 'em coming. You have all been intelligent and forthright without being nasty - a too common occurrence in the blogosphere!]

I have to agree. Shame on Adobe for this one. I have been a solid user of Adobe products for 10 years – plus. I have chosen Adobe for the editing and compositing side of my broadcast production pipeline. We have a bunch of ENG type footage coming in as AVCHD. I cannot believe that with as many cameras out there shooting AVCHD. Adobe chooses not to make this a priority to support this format. Way to let down your customers. We rely on your software, innovation and stability in the industry. I wish you would step it up and get this one solved as part of the software, not an add-on.

[DR - Hi Marc. I can't really add much to what I've already said in other comments. AVCHD is important to Adobe and we will continue to work towards a solution. Our partners, which is a valuable commodity that no other vendor has, provide solutions for people today, albeit not perfectly.

At the risk of sounding defensive (which I'm not), I can point out that AVCHD cameras have not been in the market long and while their sales are brisk now, their overall penetration as compared to DV or even HDV are comparatively small. What Adobe hasn't accurately predicted is how quickly AVCHD is being embraced by the community and thus, this post. ;-)

Thanks for your comments and please be assured that I am doing everything I can to move the ball forward with regards to AVCHD support.]

I upgraded from Acrobat, Illustrator, Flash and Photoshop as separate packages to the full CS3 Master Collection to get some of the audio and video products as I am working on those things now. I obviously assumed it would do everything I needed. What a suprise I find when I got to import an AVCHD file and nothing!

VERY DISSAPPOINTING GUYS!

I feel like I just wasted a HUGE wad of cash on a product I cannot use unless I want to spend yet another $450 for the plugin. I guess I should have done a little more research before I made the upgrade. You all know what happens when you assume.

I just got a Sony SR8 and want to edit AVCHD files natively. I purchased the Web Premium package and thinking of upgrading to the Master Collection to edit with Premiere but now thinking of going with Sony Vegas now because I’m not into work around solutions or additional plugins. Do you think Premiere will ever offer direct editing or do I have to spend another $450 on a plugin?

[DR - Yes, I do believe we'll have it. The question for you is when. If you need to edit AVC HD now then the Main Concept plugin should work for you.]

I’m going to have to agree with the others. Not supporting AVCHD is a deal breaker. I find the limited resources argument a little weak seeing as Adobe is a much larger company that many of the others that have implemented AVCHD editing and at a lower price point.

Apple’s Final Cut Express 4, Final Cut 6.01, CyberLink’s PowerDirector 6, Sony Vegas 7.0e, Vegas Pro 8, and Vegas Movie Studio Platinum 8, Corel’s Ulead VideoStudio 11 Plus, Pinnacle’s Studio Plus 11, and Avid Xpress Pro and Avid Media Composer, Canopus’ EDIUS Pro 4.5, not to mention Nero 7/8 Ultimate.

Why not wipe the egg off and sub-contract it out.

[DR – Tim, thanks for the comments.

AVCHD is important to us and I’m sure we’re working on it. However, we don’t have it today and the intent of the article is to highlight one of Adobe’s advantages to the customer which is our partners. Because we are the only large company to still publish public SDK’s we have a partner ecosystem that no one else has. It provides the AVCHD support, though all agree that they’d like Adobe to provide it.

As far as resources go, whether the limited resources argument is valid to you, it doesn’t change the fact that it is true. We have well over 50 product including some rather large ones like Photoshop, Flash and Acrobat. It is a balancing of resources as every software company does. We just missed the timing on this one which I think I’ve clearly communicated.

Lastly, while Adobe is a large company, you mentioned Sony and Apple (much larger) as well as Grass Valley and Avid (large). Can’t deny though that some small companies have built in some kind of support for AVCHD whereas we haven’t. Again, it’s something we want to fix soon.

I will ping the product manager on this and make him aware of the people posting comments here. If I get something back from him, I’ll be sure to let you know.

So, any word on from the Adobe side on this?

The Main Concept solution looks interesting, but PC only (no Mac!) and pricy.

BTW nothing comes up on the Adobe web site when I search for AVCHD from the home page!

[DR - no word thus far Kirk]

I’ve been buying Premier for over 10 years. Faithfully each new version I upgrade to. Currently I have CS3. Unfortunately it has frequently seemed that they always leave out a key format or feature that other much less expensive packages include. Learning that my CS3 suite does not support AVCHD is probably the last straw. I’m tired of paying so much and being disappointed. I likley won’t upgrade to the new version but find another product. Sorry. I think I’ll miss Premier but like a bad marriage, sometimes you have to just move on.

[DR - Mike, I know the pain you experience. We at Adobe feel it as well. Ideally, we'd like to support everything the day it comes out. However, the plain simple truth is that we have limited resources (just like everyone else) and have to pick and choose what we think is the most important things for any given release. We just missed the timing on this one.

I'm confident we will support AVC HD, and as I mention in the article, we do have support through our partners.

We care about our customers and are committed to bringing best of class software to each and every one. Give us some time Mike and I hope we can please you.]

Lets see…youre one of the leading software companies and you DONT have support for a format that is essentially all over the planet already available to consumers everywhere for as little as 500 bucks. Get real. How can you let AVCHD sneak up on you? That bus has been comin’ a long time ago. One thing is for sure, not supporting AVCHD is a BIG reason NOT to buy your software, so I’d get the lead out if I were you.

[DR - Ahh, Rob you're a feisty one! AVCHD didn't sneak up on us. Unfortunately, we just can't do everything as quickly as we would like. There are not an infinite amount of resources available. I know that sounds like a cop out, but it's our reality.

And...I do stand behind my belief that our open platform and public SDK's allow for our partner community to offer value to those customers who already have AVCHD cameras. Thanks for your comment.]

Does this support ACV-Intra too?

If you use Cineform instead can you read the files to transcode to the intermediate?

[DR - as far as I know, it does not support AVC-Intra at this time. Also with compatibility between Cineform and MainConcept...It would entirely depend on what your final edit codec would be and whether it would read the other. However, I would be that there would be a way to make it work in principle. Given that both offer a 15 day trial, I'd go for it and see what happens. ]

Hello, can you please help me.
The new mainconcept plug-in has a huge price, can you please send to
guntars.gulbis@gmail.com serial #, please…

[DR - Sorry Guntars, but that is not possible. You can download the trial and give it a spin to make sure it will work for you, but I am not the owner of Main Concept (DIVX now is) and so it's up to them to sell software as they see fit.]

Nice to see a workaround, but I think it’s fair to say that Adobe can’t expect Premiere customers to buy additinal plugins to support such a widespread format. Especially when thinking about the support for the format in similar and even lower end applications.

[DR – I don’t think as Adobe we expect you to purchase a plugin to support AVCHD. Rather, I’m publicizing a solution to a popular format that we currently don’t support. The fact of the matter is that there are always emerging formats and as a software provider, we can’t support them all as quickly as we would like.

This is why I think it so important to point out that only Adobe offers an SDK to allow companies like Main Concept to support AVC HD and offer CHOICE to customers. THe ecosystem of hardware/software providers allows users to choose to expand their available list of codecs and workflows.

And yes, I think AVC HD is important and its probably a questions of WHEN and not IF we support AVC HD. We just don’t have it today.

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