May 14, 2012

Creative Cloud vs. Piracy

Some perspective from The Next Web:

Adobe’s main competitor in this space isn’t competing products, interestingly enough; it’s Bit Torrent. Will $50/month convince the masses that are still pirating the software to go legit? My money’s on yes. A subscription works out to less than $2 a day. That’s less than the cost of a cheap sandwich. And with it you receive full, legal, supported access to all Adobe products with update requests that don’t make you sweat.

Adobe has been listening all along and taken a huge but necessary gamble; it has completely revamped its pricing system…For design and creative professionals it should be a no brainer.

Posted by John Nack at 10:57 AM on May 14, 2012

Comments

  • Ted Azriel — 11:24 AM on May 14, 2012

    Does Adobe have figures on ahow many people have signed up for cloud? Curious in knowing what the the feedback is on this service.

    [I haven’t seen publicly released numbers, but I think they’re sort of orthogonal to what you want to know, which is how valuable those who sign up find it. –J.]

    • STr3o — 2:36 PM on May 14, 2012

      Hello Mr Nack, that’s fifteen years since I used Photoshop illegally, and I subscribed to the creative cloud is an excellent initiative! Too bad the non-professionals can not touch a vat € 49.99.
      I love the CS6 version of my favorite applications !
      Well done !!

  • SFX — 11:39 AM on May 14, 2012

    I think that Creative Cloud from Adobe is the best way to fight for users with bit torrent trackers. It is much better way than spending money on lawyers.
    Make software more avaliable for small businness and frelancers is the way to go.

    • Curly — 1:24 PM on June 23, 2013

      I think you are wrong my friend.

      Now I have the Photoshop and Premiere DC walk on my PC without even having opened an Adobe ID.

  • Rich Morey — 11:42 AM on May 14, 2012

    I was already a licensed user of Adobe products, but I opted for the Web Premium edition of CS4 and generally only upgraded every two revisions (CS2, CS4, now CS6) but with the great pricing of the Creative Cloud and access to all Adobe products its a no-brainer!

    [Cool–glad to hear it, Rich. –J.]

  • quentin — 11:45 AM on May 14, 2012

    I signed up for the creative cloud option right away. After a longer period of time it may end up costing a bit more, but having early access to features, as well as the cloud services access made it a no-brainer. This is one of the very few times where I see a SaaS/subscription approach to productivity/professional software being very well executed.

  • Royi — 12:01 PM on May 14, 2012

    But I don’t have to buy a sandwich a year ahead.

    I think if Adobe sets 2$ per day of usage that would work.

  • German Hernandez — 12:14 PM on May 14, 2012

    also from the article: “It’s also not available worldwide yet which will frustrate many.”

  • Marc Rinderknecht — 12:27 PM on May 14, 2012

    The monthly paynent system is absolutely fair and ok and for sure a very good move. But the fact that international prices are about 50% higher than US prices is still not understandable (it’s a digital download anyways). I would not be astonished if piracy in non US countries is far higher.
    It’s time to treat all customers equally.

    • Rubén Santiago — 2:36 AM on May 15, 2012

      I am completely agree. Here in Spain for examples, prices are 60% more expensive than in US, what’s understandable I mean, even having in account VAT & taxes 80-85 $ a month is a huge investment.

  • Josh — 12:43 PM on May 14, 2012

    John, are there any Creative Cloud options that Adobe is putting together for enterprises? Maybe volume-licensing via Creative Cloud? Ways to avoid requiring admin access for every user that uses the cloud so that updates aren’t perpetually a snag? Ways to defer updates until IT admins can review? These are some of the reasons my company can’t jump on the cloud bandwagon right now…

    [I’m getting similar questions from lots of folks, so I’ll try to spin up a dedicated blog post on the subject shortly. –J.]

    • Steve Laskevitch — 3:39 PM on May 14, 2012

      This would be good for us as well (we’re a training company). I’ll look for that dedicated blog post.

  • karl — 12:55 PM on May 14, 2012

    … but it’s still writing in the MBR and destroying bootloaders? Hint: the “free” versions don’t do this :)

    Btw: The next version I’ll buy is a Linux version of the Creative Suite. Till then I’ll use my current (paid) thing.

  • polyxo — 1:13 PM on May 14, 2012

    I think there’s one aspect which in my perception gets entirely forgotten in the whole software renting idea. If one rents a car one can drive it. Simple as that. The Light-switch may be in a odd location maybe but that’s about it. Even in todays Citroens.
    It however takes years for everyone to master your products, let alone several of them, The need to pay every month will remind the customer of having been lazy or of effectively not having had the time to dive into new workflows. I would just hate to pay when having the feeling to have failed. This sort of confrontation and frustration does not occour when having a permanent license.

    • scott — 3:02 AM on June 29, 2012

      Hi polyox,

      Your post makes me smile cuz in the early years you are describing what I was like. Just had to have PS, but didn’t know what to do with it. :)

      your post mentions learning curve and subscription being a constant reminder to some, like me originally, about money going down the tubes with no results.

      In a sense you are saying if they buy it and don’t use it, at least they don’t constantly feel bad :), on the other hand if they subscribe, they can stop the subscription until they need it. Maybe that is good.

  • 4442 — 1:14 PM on May 14, 2012

    if you make it 50$ a year for hobbyists then maybe….

    and as long as adobe rips of non us citizens…

    i think no

  • Richard Broom — 1:21 PM on May 14, 2012

    Hate to be pessimistic I’ve been in the security business for over 30 years and know only too well that there are people would still steal product even if it cost next to nothing and maybe even nothing. There are parts of the world where ‘hooky’ software is knocked out on an industrial scale. The funny thing is, I have known seemingly respectable people who wouldn’t dream of stealing anything anywhere but software theft seems to be entirely acceptable and even something to boast about. There’s no understanding the human condition sometimes!

    [Totally agreed that price is just an excuse much of the time. (Ask the makers of great $1 iOS apps & games like The Incident how much they see their wares on warez sites.) Still, the rise of iTunes music sales shows that many people will do the right thing as long as it’s affordable & at least as convenient as stealing. –J.]

  • Rob H — 1:36 PM on May 14, 2012

    I signed up for Creative Cloud right away. For a small / medium business the price is affordable (and the first year CS3+ discount is über-compelling!)

    Can’t wait to see the team options coming later this year. Just keep the updates coming on a regular schedule – no one wants to see Creative Cloud turn into Adobe’s version of Vista Ultimate Extras.

    Lightroom 4, hint hint! :)

  • 4442 — 1:45 PM on May 14, 2012

    btw: i some parts of the world 2$ would be what people earn in a few days of hard labor.

    • Adam Pratt — 6:05 PM on May 14, 2012

      True, and I’ve spent extended periods of time in some of the poorest places in the world. $2 a day is more than a full day’s wages in some countries, but those people also don’t have a dual-core machine with 4GB RAM, 1TB hard drive, hi-res LCD monitor…or electricity. Not every person in the world is the target market for Creative Cloud. Frankly, they face more import needs than 64-bit computing.

  • Ben — 1:57 PM on May 14, 2012

    The biggest problem I have with the Cloud isn’t the pricing but the lack of value in the options. I still feel like I’m paying for programs that I don’t want or need. I don’t need the Video applications and I don’t want Muse (imo it is to DW as Elements is to Photoshop). I worry that money could be pushed towards those programs I don’t use as often and ones that I do use may not get the benefits they deserve. The one program that comes to mind is Fireworks, an often overlooked but invaluable tool for prototyping and wireframing.

  • Delos — 2:13 PM on May 14, 2012

    I’m totally bought into the Creative Cloud and, even though I’m not a professional designer or photographer, plan to use many of the programs as I rekindle my interests in web design and videography. I’ve been a Photoshop user who for years has agonized over to upgrade or not. Now I don’t have to worry about that. For roughly the cost of PS alone, I’m getting everything and all the upgrades, to all the programs. I think the Creative Cloud plan is the deal of the decade.

  • Skyler Kline — 2:19 PM on May 14, 2012

    As someone who has been somewhat vocal about Adobe’s pricing being too high, I have to say I’m impressed.
    It obviously won’t satisfy everyone, but it’s nice change.

    I have to comment on people saying there aren’t enough options.
    That’s a beautiful thing in my opinion. I’m not a video editor, but if I had to help someone with a video project, even my son, there would be no investment required. Same for web, or any other field that I might not be willing to shell out money for software for. Now I have that option.

    I haven’t even played with the cloud features yet, but so far am impressed. Good job Adobe, and thank you for listening. I hope it pays off for you.
    Also, good job overall on CS6, best upgrade in years.

  • Rick — 3:10 PM on May 14, 2012

    I am a longtime user of Photoshop, but purely as a hobbiest. I had to scrmp and save to buy CS4 Extended and have been concerned about when/if I can ever afford an upgrade. From my perspective, $49 / month is WAY too expensive for my needs. I’ll stick with my CS4 version until it’s no longer supported, then maybe switch to Gimp.

    [Did you know that you can get Photoshop on its own for just $19.99/mo.? –J.]

    • Jen — 2:11 AM on May 16, 2012

      “I’ll stick with my CS4 version until it’s no longer supported, then maybe switch to Gimp.”

      Didn’t you get the memo? CS5.5 isn’t even supported anymore according to Adobe.

    • Silence7 — 12:22 PM on May 16, 2012

      Hmm… “Every CS6 tool and so much more.From US $49.99/month”, or $19.99 for JUST Photoshop. Something seems a little off here.

      I’m currently on Photoshop Extended CS5. For the amount I use Photoshop I have a hard time justifying the $399 to upgrade. I really will have no choice because of the new One Version Back policy. Well, I do have a choice, I can stay on CS5 until it will no longer run on my shiny new Windows 11 machine in the year 2015. Then pay full price for Photoshop AGAIN.

      At that point I’m sure Adobe will have moved to an only rental model, and I’ll be paying $89 a month for just Photoshop.

      What I would like to see is some sort of incentive program for frequent upgraders. Every time you upgrade your price gets cheaper and cheaper down to a certain point where it costs say $100 to upgrade Photoshop, and say $200 for a Creative Suite, and $400 for the Master Collection. That sounds reasonable for customers who are loyal and have upgraded 3 times in the past.

      More people than ever are using Photoshop, but the one version back policy is going to kill it. I’m sure that when people start realizing they missed the boat to upgrade to the next version and are looking at either a $700 or $1000 bill, other programs are going to start looking better. Either that, or that shady guy selling copies on Craigslist is going to be doing a lot of business.

  • Nuno Ferreira — 3:34 PM on May 14, 2012

    I was very excited when I read that Adobe would release a annual and monthly subscription to use all the software, plus some extras. I was very frustrated and disappointed when I saw that the price difference that US costumers and European costumers would pay was huge and outrageous. Not fair! I’m still thinking if I keep my money or if I subscribe to Creative Cloud.

  • Peter — 3:36 PM on May 14, 2012

    The only reason I am currently still in favor of buying the traditional version versus a subscription is that you don’t get to own the software even after you subscribed for a full product cycle. For me being able to archive old versions to be able to access files is very important, and I think if I pay as much as the traditional retail version would cost through a continuous subscription service that spans an entire product cycle, I think I should at least get to own a full non-restricted copy of the old product when the new release comes out.

    Another question is whether I’d be able to get the US version in Europe – I don’t want to have to deal with localized versions (much harder to google solutions for problems when they come up, occasionally confusing translations, plus translated versions take up more screen space on small laptop displays etc.), and the non-US versions are a lot more expensive of course.

    Another thing that very much annoys me about the subscription version (and the activation system in the regular version) is that they constantly want to connect to the internet and transmit data, which is a constant security risk and quite frankly not necessary at all. There are other ways to do this.

    I actually know of several people with completely legal licenses who still apply cracks to their legal versions just to prevent them from phoning home. This isn’t making it hard for pirates (ironically, those are the only ones who don’t have to put up with this stuff), it’s making it hard for regular customers. And I still remember the first version of the activation system trashing harddrives because it used reserved sectors to store the activation data. And then there was of course support being no help when the license manager randomly failed for people, thanks to Murphy’s law especially during night shifts on tight deadlines and things like that.

  • Dennis — 4:41 PM on May 14, 2012

    “…A subscription works out to less than $2 a day…”

    In 18 months (the normal product life cycle) it works out to $900.

    Not bad until you realize that if you stop paying, you can’t use the software anymore. Er no thanks.

    Right now I pay $375 for the CS6 upgrade that will last 18 months until CS7.

    $900 vs $375 for 18 months and I can chose NOT to upgrade.

    • Adam Pratt — 6:10 PM on May 14, 2012

      For a more accurate comparison you should remember three things:

      1. Creative Suite has been on a 12-month release cycle for the past few years, not 18-months.

      2. With Creative Cloud you’re getting more tools than any CS Suite, even Master Collection.

      3. Creative Cloud will give you access to more apps and features BEFORE the next major release of Creative Suite (Lightroom, Acrobat Next, etc.)

      • Tim — 1:11 PM on June 06, 2012

        1. Yes, but how often do you need the latest version? The version you bought does what you need, which is why you bought it. People only upgrade if the upgrade saves them more time, or gets them more new functionality, than the cost of the upgrade. (Or if the old version doesn’t support their new hardware and OS, ouch.) Most people I know upgrade every 2 years.

        2. Yes, but again, how many of those do you need? 99% of the Adobe CS users I know use only 1 or 2 apps. On a checklist it looks cool that you get SpeedGrade and Prelude, but the people who want Photoshop or Illustrator are usually in a quite different field of work.

        3. Yes, the main theme here seems to be “Creative Cloud gives you more”. It’s up to you to decide if that’s worth paying an extra $525 every 18 months. Most Adobe customers I know would not be excited about nearly tripling their costs just to get every Adobe product. After all, if you don’t count upgrades, the “Master Collection” gives you almost every Adobe product for only double the price of “Design Standard”.

        The big win of Creative Cloud is that you can buy a fraction of a license: Photoshop for 1 month is $30, instead of being $700 for a license (which will last you between “12 months” and “forever”).

  • 8bf — 4:58 PM on May 14, 2012

    LOL I love when people try to break down a overcharge and justify it by saying well over time its only x amount a day less than the cost of such and such.Give us some credit John! It doesn’t change the fact it still costs more over time and you don’t end up owning it. Let’s see if you bought something paid more and the seller used the same logic how you would react with such math used to justify overcharging for the same product. 50 bucks is more than it should be per month especially when your not owning but renting.

    John must take us all for idiots; excuse me ADOBE must take us for idiots.

    Yeah no brainer John overpay to “rent”not own the software. Being pushed into a forced upgrade model. Oh and using vagueness like updates faster and other pseudo marketing babble. Whats wrong with the current state of getting updates from the adobe site or using adobe update? What are you guys planning on releasing new updates daily or even weekly? Seriously doubt it Come on adobe may try this crap with companies that have money to waste but most end users aren’t dumb and insisting this is more convenient is obvious B.S aimed to line adobe’s pockets

    In what universe is this subscription model supposed to be fair?

    • jcool — 8:05 AM on May 16, 2012

      Yes, but have you considered that it’s only $.08 an hour? /sarcasm

      I agree completely. I haven’t run the numbers in a while, and Adobe can’t seem to keep things straight, but I believe signing up for the creative cloud is basically equivalent to upgrading the Master Collection every year. And you own nothing.

      [Technically, you never did. –J.]

      For most non-corporate users IT’S NOT A GOOD DEAL. It does make sense, at least in the short run, for some users and many corporations.

      [So, we’re now providing access to a $2600 set of tools for $50/mo. or less, and that’s not good for people? Tough crowd. –J.]

      However, the big winner here is Adobe.

      They tighten the upgrade screws to shift those users, introduce a monthly plan at the Master Collection level, and boom, they just stabilized their revenue at a higher number than before, and people are now hooked because if they stop paying they lose everything. Great for Adobe, users get shafted in the long run.

      This is what happens when one company has a virtual monopoly on professional solutions in a market.

      • jcool — 12:13 PM on May 16, 2012

        Knock off the licensing pedantry John. ;-) You know what I mean.

        It’s not a good deal compared to Adobe’s traditional upgrade
        pricing, which is what current users should be comparing it to.
        (Unless you own the Master Collection and upgrade it yearly)

        So when Adobe says “Hey, sign up for the CC, it’s great”, I look at my CS5.5 Design Premium suite, do the math, and say “Why should I pay more for stuff I don’t use”, and get nothing if I stop paying?

        Now if you reframe the question to: “Is the entire suite of Adobe software worth $50/mo?” You could make a great argument that it is. The value proposition of the Adobe Suite has never been in doubt, at least not for me. It’s the value of the upgrades that’s been the question. Adobe is solving that problem by creating a system where they don’t need to deliver upgrades at all….so, problem solved.

        • Tim — 1:21 PM on June 06, 2012

          “[So, we’re now providing access to a $2600 set of tools for $50/mo. or less, and that’s not good for people? Tough crowd. –J.]”

          It’s a set of tools you charge $525 to upgrade from the previous version. The $2600 price is a one-time cost.

          Or you can upgrade from a $1300-cheaper package for only $1050. Or buy a used copy off ebay for $800 and upgrade for $525. Even if you don’t care about updating, there have already been plenty of ways to legitimately get “a $2600 set of tools” for way less than $2600.

    • AREL KRUEGER — 3:54 PM on May 16, 2012

      Sometimes renting is a better option. How many of us BUY A HOTEL vs. HOW MANY OF US JUST RENT A ROOM ONCE IN A WHILE. Buying is not always the better option. I think Adobe has thought this out well. I am able to use the most current version always which is a money saver in itself. Newer versions always are easier to use and get things done and they can do more. I think i can make at least $2 a day and put that towards my “rent.” Special thanks to Adobe because people still have the option to buy and/or rent. ….and I choose to rent :)

  • Robert — 6:15 PM on May 14, 2012

    I think some of the posters here are being pretty hard on Adobe. They are speaking from the perspective of a user who has the upgrade option. I haven’t used a suite since Macromedia MX 2004, so I am very happy to have access to everything via Creative Cloud. I figure with the existing user discount, it’s a great deal, and if I’m making profitable use of the entire suite in a year, the regular price is also a good deal. Based on a full license purchase of the Master Suite, I figure I am breaking even until about 6 years into the future. After that, I may still find it worthwhile, as I like upgrades, and like getting them fast. I have also found, in using Photoshop since version CS, that Adobe usually implements some pretty significant changes with their upgrades. So, John, I disagree with some of the harsh opinions expressed above.

  • Robert — 6:18 PM on May 14, 2012

    I forgot to mention– it would be nice if, after a period of time, say 4 to 5 years, a customer could be eligible for the upgrade pricing on one of the suites, if for some reason they don’t want to continue with the Creative Cloud.

  • 8bf — 6:41 PM on May 14, 2012

    listen john can cover for adobe all he wants and spin this every which way he or adobe wants.Faster upgrades blah blah Fact is most users are not stupid and blind and its pretty damn insulting adobe thinks its customers are so stupid we don’t see the flaws in this subscription model . We can add up the math and see that in the long run this “renting” of the suite doesn’t make any sense vs. outright buying in and owning it.

    [Then don’t subscribe. If the value isn’t there for you, then we haven’t won your business. There’s no gun to your head. –J.]

    So in response to your question in regards to piracy John. No this cloud model will if anything push people towards piracy and have the opposite effect if anything. Maybe if adobe i dunno made the fee equivalent to the purchase cost and ability to own when finished renting.

    But adobe wouldn’t do anything that stupid would they? heaven forbid they sacrifice money for customer satisfaction

    This plan will if anything sour many people on adobe and make piracy more inviting. Since this looks like a plain cash grab

    [Thanks for your input. I think you’ve now said your peace. At some point (arguably long since passed), one moves from spirited debater/dissident to troll. You’re welcome to keep repeating yourself & not moving the discussion forward, and I’ll feel free to save everyone the time spent reading your posts. –J.]

    • KC — 7:04 AM on May 15, 2012

      Note to other posters—John/Adobe only want to have mouthpieces post how wonderful the subscription model is. Please do not post anything negative regarding the subscription model.

      [I would hope that statement is plainly untrue. A quick scan of the comments here reveals a range of opinions, and that’s all good. What’s *not* good is having the same pseudonymous guy post the same things over & over & over. That doesn’t advance the conversation; rather, it just drowns out legitimate exchanges of ideas. –J.]

      It is absolutely amazing how John/Adobe can come up with excuses for one to buy-in to the subscription model, but neither can honestly answer for the extreme cost differences and legitimate reasons NOT to buy-in to the subscription model. The best they can come up with is—”You’re a troll.” “Fine. You’re welcome to not buy-in.” Sounds like a temper-tantrum…

      [I’m sorry it sounds that way. (I guess it sounds that way more when you attribute to me remarks I didn’t make.) You’ll find that I’m incredibly tolerant of commenters, even those that seem really counterproductive. This is only the second time in 6 years of daily blogging that I’ve had t tell someone in this way to pipe down. This particular guy (?) repeats the same browbeating pattern, and I’ve tried to speak to him about it in the past (which is of course, given the fake name/email address). –J.]

      Side note: Has anybody tracked how long music subscription models/companies stayed in business? Rent-to-not-own your music failed miserably—how is this going to be any better?

      [I don’t remember anyone ever offering “rent-to-own” of music, and Adobe isn’t offering “rent-to-own” here. –J.]

      • KC — 7:40 AM on May 16, 2012

        Failed (or seriously struggling) music subscription services:
        – Sony Music Entertainment (solo attempt)
        – Duet/pressplay (Universal Music Group and Sony Music Entertainment)
        – MusicNet (EMI, AOL/Time Warner, and Bertelsmann Music Group)
        – MusicNow
        – Total Music
        – Listen.com

        [I’m not sure what music subscriptions have to do with software subscriptions. In any case, those aren’t “rent-to-own” services as you stated. –J.]

        • KC — 7:13 AM on May 17, 2012

          Umm, my original comment said “rent-to-not-own” music, which is exactly what those companies listed tried to do (or are currently trying to do) and failed (or are failing).

          This is EXACTLY what Adobe is doing: rent-to-not-own your software. As soon as you stop your monthly “rental” fee, you no longer get to use the software. I think it makes a very good comparison.

          [I apologize for misreading. A simpler way to say “rent-to-not-own” is “rent.” You could then bring up cars, real estate, etc., and how no one rents any of those. –J.]

      • AREL KRUEGER — 4:06 PM on May 16, 2012

        Adobe has come up with an ADDITIONAL option that may or may not be for everyone. IT IS EXACTLY WHAT I HAVE BEEN WISHING FOR. It is also much easier to justify a monthly fee then an once a year purchase. I don’t have to save up to get the most current version. KUDOS ADOBE, YOU ARE GREAT AND HAVE DONE IT AGAIN… Now a great product has a great subscription option. :)
        …and i love having all the programs… i will add web design to what i can do now. All for $2 a day. AMAZING!!!

        • KC — 7:31 AM on May 17, 2012

          Arel, are you a paid shill for Adobe? A lot of comments on here blindly backing Adobe. Funny how the over-the-top applauding of Adobe gets no negative reaction from John/Adobe—only the negative commenters get chastised.

          Can you also shed some light on the unmentioned-on-this-site recent faux pas of Adobe requiring CS5.5 users to pay for the upgrade to CS6 in order to be protected from a significant security flaw? What “spin” can you provide to turn that into a positive? Reference: http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9227119/Adobe_backpedals_will_now_patch_software_for_free?taxonomyId=17

          Regarding the ADDITIONAL option you are stressing: do you have any “insider” information saying that this “option” will always stay an option? Like myself, many are afraid that this will become the ONLY business model Adobe will allow for use of its products.

          However, with this cloud nonsense does have a silver lining—a huge gaping hole that Adobe has opened for competition (John, please insert your ‘Adobe has always welcomed competition’ statement here.) With so many disgruntled about the subscription service, old (Apple and Quark) and new (Pixelmator) have a grand opportunity to provide some serious competition. In short, Adobe has shot itself in the foot.

        • Taylor Garvin — 11:21 AM on May 09, 2013

          You’ve been trolling for three days now. I’ve seen your name on so many different sites pretending like you just heard about this and it’s exactly what you need.

    • Keith Reeder — 10:23 AM on May 10, 2013

      “Fact is most users are not stupid and blind”

      Fact is, you’re not speaking for “most users”.

  • Thomas — 7:07 PM on May 14, 2012

    with (in my company) 200 seats per upgrade per year (multiply this number with more seats, per company, worldwide) Adobe made goods + stock exchange to feed two worlds size of the sun.

    but

    with illegal (pirates) users you maybe quadroupled up the math for the future.

    well don Adobe, well done. Even if you do not provide a slider for interface brightness in Photoshop = like most of your apps do.

    [Oh my God, how will you ever live with just *four choices* for UI brightness, when for 22 years you had none? Oh, the humanity… –J.]

    Go future my friends, but toss the arrogance upon Photoshop (and tablets) and clear the roads for some real good and nice stuff.

  • Bob — 7:15 PM on May 14, 2012

    I agree with Thomas… It is too expensive, I am interested in the model, but I see it as a money loser for the hobbiest… They need a hobby version that you can upgrade for commercial work. I started out with photoshop cs3, and upgraded to premier pro cs5, this doesn’t provide an advantage to my budget, if anything, it just makes my options worse.. :-(

    • AREL KRUEGER — 4:26 PM on May 16, 2012

      Adobe’s Creative Cloud is what I plan to use to make extra money for myself. I can justify $2 a day by just billing one or two small jobs a week. For the record, my hobby is gardening and i spend more than $60 a month on that. I think the price here is very reasonable and the value is unbeatable. I would hate for Adobe to lower the price and reduce their moneys and therefore reduce the manpower put into making the product the best that it is. If you want a “cheap graphics design product” guys, go buy one. If you want the best one, pay the $2 a day and look for ways to pay for it. Move forward. Update your website, add QR codes to everything and get moving :)

      • Bob — 1:52 PM on May 17, 2012

        Ariel,
        I do believe in paying for my software and have bought several updates for photoshop, and even bought a second copy for my Mac, so I could have one on my wife’s pc and one on my Mac. I do this as a hobbyiest, and make my living as a software developor(embedded) so I am well aware of the difficulties and costs of developing software. Making copies is not the cost, it’s the development. This does not mean that software should be free.

        However paying more per copy of software does not mean that adobe will raise more money to support development, just as raising taxes does’t necessarily mean that the government gets more income. Adobe still needs to be able to sell to raise this money. Adobe could lower prices, but just change the upgrade policy, to one version back(oops they did,darn them!!) and raise more money. I think more people are going to invest in alternatives, which won’t be good for adobe’s bottom line.

        I enjoy John’s blog and hope he continues to read all these comments. Maybe it will help bring some sense to adobe’s pricing model for us hobbyists..

        [I do read all the comments, but I don’t get a chance to respond to every one. Thanks for all the feedback. It really does influence a lot of thinking at Adobe. –J.]

        • Bob — 2:02 PM on May 17, 2012

          Ariel,
          Just wanted to add based on your other comments focused on business users. I totally agree with comments on business users, this is a good deal for businesses. This is their tools and if I made my living off of adobe’s products i would see the advantage of a cloud subscription. I do think adobe should look at microsoft’s approach for non commercial users and the seperate price scale the they maintain for the same products.

          Bob

          • Bob — 2:11 PM on May 17, 2012

            Oops. Arel, not Ariel… I blame my iPad’ autocorrect.. My apologies..

  • Bob — 7:17 PM on May 14, 2012

    Oops.. Agreed with the wrong person.. I meant 8bf..

  • Eric — 7:20 PM on May 14, 2012

    I’ve been a big supporter of Adobe for a long, long time. But I have to say, there are several problems here.

    1: You have to pay $50 a month to get more than two applications. And then you get them all. I don’t want them all. Not even close. I want maybe four or five. How about breaking it down to $25 a month for the Design Premium Suite? That’s still $300 a year. And considering upgrades used to be 18-24 months, that’s still about the same.

    2: Pricing of the boxed versions are designed to drive us to the subscription model. But I don’t want the subscription model because the cloud stuff is useless to me. Our IT department blocks such services outside the firewall.

    3: I would love to pay the upgrade price for the Design Premium Suite (with the NPPA discount), but then in 12 months, I’m paying again. Why? Because you won’t let people jump upgrade cycles. Again, no doubt a move to drive people to the cloud.

    I’m not interested in the cloud. It does nothing for me as a professional photographer who travels the world and mostly needs Lightroom and Photoshop, but do need Dreamweaver, Flash (for the next six months and for maintenance – and then it’s banished from our educational material going forward because we want everything mobile), and Illustrator from time to time. But not enough to justify $50 a month! But too often to turn off subscriptions for those apps enough.

    I know it’s probably asking too much for your registration servers to handle a wider variety of options. But it just seems there’s too much ham-fisted driving us to the cloud, even if we don’t need it or want it. I just feel like we’re all being ripped off with all these policy changes and lack of being able to jump versions and continue to upgrade.

    Oh, I’ll buy something. But I’m looking for alternatives for Dreamweaver, and I can probably live without Illustrator. Flash, that’s a non-starter over the long-haul. So I’m back to $20 for Photoshop or $50 for a few other things I sometimes need, but would prefer to stick with the boxed suites. I feel I’m being treated like a second-class customer because I’m not jumping on board with the cloud.

    John, you know I don’t harbor ill feelings towards Adobe. It just feels like the desire for profits is blinding Adobe to a large portion of their customers who are square pegs in these newly rounded holes.

  • Tim Baigent — 8:02 PM on May 14, 2012

    I am a very enthusiastic user, purchaser, early adopter. I have purchased CS6 in the traditional way, and may possibly buy another licence using the subsription facility. I like having both options. Well done.

    But even I have a bitter taste in my mouth about pricing differentials between the US and elsewhere–in my case, New Zealand.

    The differential is large, it very much sucks, there’s no good reason for it, and it’s insulting.

    Just Stop It.

  • Rosyna — 10:28 PM on May 14, 2012

    I really, really appreciate the subscription model. Since I only use Adobe CS apps to test things in, this model is perfect!

    And Adobe offers higher quality products for a cheaper price than the company that provides cable TV to me.

  • Maciej — 12:39 AM on May 15, 2012

    Creative cloud is something absolutely stunning. I did extensive research on it. Plans on future development describe on CC blog is very promising.
    But what it means to Adobe vs. Piracy.
    I have no idea from business perspective, after reading some comments above I am kind of confused.

    For years I been watching people using Adobe products, people with “experience” and some position in creative field. Sadly 25 of 30 is lacking basic knowledge and what is worse they seem not to be interested in learning.

    My point is, it looks like it will take a lot, to educate.

    Now, dollars vs euros… Let’s take Poland for example. 50$ monthly for 90% of your most important tools is not bad, it is actually good, and a lot of people living their life and running their company’s in fear of being pirates – will at least start to think.
    But here is the deal, if you’re in Poland, you have to pay in euros, as for today that equals 78$ not 50$. With average salary at 500$ you can imagine yourself.
    I know, I know taxes… well if someone is not paying for software, he is probably avoiding tax as well, if he can.

    As for a hobbyist version :-) Last time I checked, there is no distinction in pricing for hobbyist discount at Bentley, for driving enthusiasts.

  • 4442 — 1:05 AM on May 15, 2012

    but bentleys are not that much stolen then CS. ;)

    if adobe wants to make money from people who use warez they have to lower the price.

    otherwise nothing will change.

    • AREL KRUEGER — 4:45 PM on May 16, 2012

      Should Department stores lower the price on items that are getting stolen? Price should not be determined by thieves. If Adobe can get people that were “stealing” their product to pay for this low monthly cloud price, then maybe with more money coming in they can improve the product and/or lower the price. More important, people like myself who cannot fork out the whole pkg price, but can pay the monthly price, will be able to add monies to Adobe for development. I am looking forward to the Upgrades on a timely basis. Well Done Adobe. You are the Best and now are affordable!!

  • Endthemonopoly — 1:09 AM on May 15, 2012

    On the other hand should we really be giving a company money who doesn’t seems to be bothered about fixing critical security holes in a very expensive product that is under 2 years old until they get bad press about it.

  • TomasF — 2:40 AM on May 15, 2012

    As I’ve said before I was ready for Creative Cloud with the credit card in my hand, until I saw the local price. Now I’m not sure what to do. Previously I’ve been in a job where my employer paid an Creative Suite license for me, but atm I’m not. I might have paid the $70-80 it ends up as here if I didn’t know it was a $20-30 surcharge that I get nothing in return from (I’ve been a customer, remember. I know I don’t get localized software, localized support, or even download from local servers). And Adobes other argument (when they’re not dodging the issue like in this thread), that it’s more expensive to do business everywhere else in the world, doesn’t seem to apply to any other software company, because I don’t face this buying from MS, Corel, VMware, etc. Apparently this cost doesn’t apply to Lightroom 4 either, which is suddenly more sensibly priced than any other Adobe product for non-us residents.

    Anyways, what I really wanted to say is I can’t wait for Adobe (probably through BSA) to release a study showing that piracy of Adobe products went down in the US but not in the rest of the world. I’ll be back to tell you why then… ;) I’ll even waive my consultancy fee…

    • AREL KRUEGER — 4:52 PM on May 16, 2012

      if the cloud is not for you, then you can still buy the traditional products. Adobe is not a cheap product. It is Robust and full of Power. It makes my life much easier at work. Upgrading to CS5.5 was the best thing i did 6 months ago. The upgrades in the program made it well worth the money to upgrade. Now I am getting the Cloud for myself at home. GREAT JOB ADOBE….

      • TomasF — 12:24 PM on May 17, 2012

        If you don’t bother reading what you’re replying to you might as well not bother. And yes, the esd and boxed products are about 25% higher priced than in the US as well. The only difference is that for the boxed product you could make the argument that there’s an additional cost for localized packaging. Except for my location it’s always just US English anyway, so that’s moot as well.

  • Stephen Walker — 4:16 AM on May 15, 2012

    Creative Cloud is a win, win product.We win, Adobe wins (no distribution/packaging costs must also be a huge saving). That’s how the world should work.

    One additional bonus not mentioned is that if my computer is stolen I can hopefully get Adobe to deactivate that particular subscription and activate a new one. That way when I lose my computer I don’t end up losing my licence as well.
    This means a saving on insurance too.

    My only problem is that it isn’t available in South Africa as yet ??
    And why do we all pay more than the USA for software downloads ?
    If I buy something from Apple’s App Store it costs the same (in Dollar terms) in the USA or South Africa or wherever). Why isn’t that same concept operational for Adobe software.
    Can’t be taxes, etc as Apple seem to bypass that problem. So what is it ?

    Still, the whole idea is brilliant.
    Can’t wait for it to come to SA.

  • Arnon Moscona — 8:33 AM on May 15, 2012

    Congratulations on taking a lead on this. The best way to fight piracy is to make pricing a win-win proposition.

    I am quite sure that you will win over pretty much anybody who you could possibly win over. The remainder will be people who would never pay anyway. Those are not “lost sales”, as no maneuver would get them to pay.

    For myself, I use Photoshop and Lightroom (full pay) and so far remained with this combination. But if I decide that I want anything more I would definitely go for Creative Cloud. So it’s not only about piracy. If you are not willing to shell out a large chunk of money for a full suite, paying $50/month makes a lot of sense. Especially with Adobe giving the option to discontinue and stay with your regularly licensed products.

    So you can get revenue from “surge” use when someone needs a limited time use of the full suite for a while and would not buy the whole thing outright. For short term, rental works fantastically well.

    I hope that you will continue offering both models in parallel for a long long time.

  • Ken — 8:44 AM on May 15, 2012

    WOW John,

    You really put your neck out here for all the posts.

    I am at an age (now 66), I have now decided its ok to get old. Plus I have strong affection for your (adobe) products. In a few years your critics will wonder, “why did I write that”, lol.

    I have a new “rule”. “it is forbidden to forbidden”

    be well,
    Ken in KY

  • Allen Cobb — 1:51 PM on May 15, 2012

    Since I’ve been upgrading CSMC for years now, it didn’t make economic sense to switch over to the subscription. So I upgraded again. Seems kind of simple. It only cost me $446 with a NAPP discount. That’s an awful lot of software for what looks to me like a damn reasonable price.

    When there are too many essentials on the Cloud to go without them, then I’ll have to consider paying for the Cloud. But I can still buy upgrades to prevent the apps from being killed if I stop my subscription. This strategy is the best I’ve come up with so far. Maybe the Cloud will come down in price sometime in the future.

    Allen

  • Greg Geisler — 2:55 PM on May 15, 2012

    You can’t win, John! I’m always amazed at the folks that are crying about having to spend a modest amount of money for professional tools. Really, people? $50 a month ($30 if you are a previous Suite owner) for the tools you use to earn a living (I’m not talking about hobbyists)? I’m not sure there is a better deal anywhere in the world in any profession. A computer and an internet connection and $50 gives you the ability to run a business providing a WIDE variety of services.

    I have been a Suite licensee for years and I promptly put down the $30 and will happily pay the $50 in a year. There is no other company in the world that could come close to providing the value that CC provides to creative professionals.
    Most of you complainers probably spend more money at Starbucks every month. Put it in perspective.

    • Stephen Walker — 11:31 PM on May 15, 2012

      Agree 100% Greg. Well said.
      Think Adobe have priced and positioned the product perfectly. It’s meant to be affordable to everyone. If you don’t use all the apps so what, the price is good even if you only use one program ( I assume most people use at least 3 – in which case it’s a bargain).
      And if you really don’t like it – buy a box.

    • AREL KRUEGER — 4:59 PM on May 16, 2012

      Well Said!! I agree. It is about priorities. One guy at my work complains that he doesn’t have enough money each week to pay for his gas to get to work. REALLY? Easy Solution Complainers, just pay your priorities first. What is making you money? Pay that. Then go to *$$ (starbucks). I will happily make my lunch forever if I can have full access to the Creative Cloud and for $2 a day, it is possible!!

  • Filip Krygsman — 7:00 PM on May 15, 2012

    I am also a great lover of Adobe products. I am also very disappointed with this cloud offer.
    I don’t think that it is good for any company to restrict its customers to a one choice or nothing policy. That is a very foolish way of thinking. 
    It’s not because this cloud offer is a rip off. It is not. It is the lack of choice that is so arrogant.
    A huge company like Adobe has customers of immense variety and needs. Of course this subscription thing will suit many very active users of Adobe products, but there are many customers who by now have expressed their incredible unhappiness with this limited choice and rightly so, as they are being unbelievably disadvantaged.
    I am also convinced that a large chunk of their customers will be driven to piracy. There is no doubt about that in my mind.
    You cannot bully all your customers into one option and tell them that it is good for them, because it only cost you $2 a day. That is cheap advertising and very insulting to a large chunk of loyal Adobe customers.
    Just this huge debate all over the Internet should tell Adobe that something is seriously wrong with what they are doing. People need choice.
    The economics of this package will work for some, but not for others. A very very large chunk of Adobe customers like to determine themselves when to upgrade due to the economic situation of their business and if necessary skip an upgrade for that same reason. 
    Also that same very large chunk of customers have absolutely no need for this incredible choice of beautiful apps.
    I am convinced that this arrogant and monopolistic thinking on Adobes part will hurt them a lot. You are never big enough to be taught a lesson. You may get away with it for a while, but it will come back and bite you in the long run.
    In this debate you hear a lot about professionals and hobbyist. In my opinion Adobes largest customer base lies somewhere in between these two.
    This, in my humble opinion is the relevant silent majority of their customers, who are very interested with the progress of this debate, but also very anxious about the progress of this one sided policy. The proof in the pudding will be when cs7 comes along. That’s when this incredible lack of choice will begin to byte.
    Adobes philosophy may well be that they have such a technological advantage on competitors now and even more so  in the future that this will not hurt them,  but again it is an arrogant way of thinking. This “one package fits all” strategy will create an underclass of users that will either pirate or leave and cut some of their losses in Adobes technological advantages and go somewhere else. There is no doubt Adobe products are fantastic, but you can’t rely on that advantage alone.
     The moment you think, that because of your great range of products you can dictate to your customers a basic choice and tell them it’s good because of some cheap advertising campaign of the $2 a day throwaway line you are insulting a lot of very intelligent people. 
    Especially in the long run when you have forked out thousands and thousands of dollars to Adobe and your business hits a void or when you want to sell, thats when you want to own what you have paid for over such a long period and bank on that ownership before moving ahead again. It is a natural thing for humans and businesses, that at some stage you need to make stock of what you own before moving on. That is when you will feel let down by Adobe, because you will never get to own what you have paid for. 
    It is simple arithmatics. 
    I can fill my whole house with beautiful furniture and appliances through some rental firm and when they wear a bit get them replaced with brand new stuff. It sounds so easy and simple and is affordable through monthly payments. 
    How come very few people do this…… because people want to own their things, because people instinctively know circumstances will chance and that at some point they may have to move on and take their stuff with them so they can restart somewhere else with what they have. 
    Everybody, including most businesses go through this at some stage in their careers and lives, and when you restart most of the time its done on a shoestring and you need to rely on what you already own to get ahead. It is a basic human need to own things, it represent security to us and that has been part of our psyche for very long. Adobe is gambling on chancing this inbuilt need. Gosh …. Adobe…….honestly… In what luxurious stratosphere does your management elite reside. Come back to earth and become part of the human race again. You are literally threatening us with a single choice of in or out. Nobody takes kindly to that.

     

    • helterskellter — 7:36 PM on May 15, 2012

      Ha ha, you wrote “arithmatics”! Why do “Adobe enthusiasts” tend to be the same segment so impatient as to forego skimming their thoughts and seemingly incapable of leveraging spellcheck?

      [“Maths” (and seemingly “arithmetics”) is the common usage overseas. Why do comment trolls tend to be the same segment so self-righteous as to forget that there’s a world beyond our shores? (And by the way, if you’re going to criticize others’ sloppiness, you might not want to make the same typo every time you put your URL into the comment field, rendering it unclickable. Just sayin’. –J.]

  • helterskellter — 7:31 PM on May 15, 2012

    “Creative Cloud” feels like another lame, reactive attempt by Adobe to catch up.

    [Catch up with whom? With Apple, which doesn’t support this kind of licensing option? –J.]

    Even if it proves successful for Adobe it still seems like another “oh snap! we’ve got to be a ‘me too’!”

  • Robert Roll — 12:09 AM on May 16, 2012

    Everyone seems so happy here.
    What happens if I have to stop the “$2 a day” service?
    Does Adobe erase the applications? Do I still have the use of previous versions I bought?
    Adobe seems really aggressive towards stealers and pirates, but we who have been paying retail all along kind of get jostled by the financial problem solvers (irony intended).
    Six hundred bucks a year may work out on somebody’s spreadsheet at Adobe, but that’s a lot of money. Really a lot of money.
    So here is some money, guys, but I hope I don’t lose everything if I cannot afford to make a payment one month.
    Housing crisis is what comes to mind.

    • AREL KRUEGER — 5:14 PM on May 16, 2012

      Why would you stop a service that is making you money if it only costs $2 a day? What if you stop paying for your internet? Will they let you finish communicating with all your customers? I don’t think so. Base your price on your “costs” not your competition. If you cannot be competitive then maybe you need to get better and faster at using the programs. I know people who struggle with the programs and think they are losing money. The easy solution is to educate yourself so that you can perform better and be a better value to your customers. There are many online sources for learning that only cost $25 – $30 a month for unlimited training. That is only $1 a day. :)

    • George Mercado — 12:22 PM on March 21, 2013

      Bullshit RIP OFF, so I spend $600+ dollars a year for software, but lets say I cancel due to some mishap or bad finance. I then lose all rights to using the software and cannot use it. SO I spent $600 to lease/rent the software? No ownership, no licensing rights? That is highway robbery.

      This isnt going to stop piracy but on the contrary will make people download it more and just burn the disks. At the end of the day it is what it is, its not ownership, it renting and you will never own it as you do when you buy the suite itself. Complete and utter adobe bullshit!

  • Shai S — 12:31 AM on May 16, 2012

    It’s a pity that this model is not available worldwide. I think that many small businesses, studios and freelancers would use this option if given the chance.
    Isn’t there a way to make this worldwide? (along with decent education, student and teacher, plans)

    I absolutely love Adobes products and I think that all in all Adobe is a pro user company. it just pains me to have to deal with unmotivated local re-sellers.

  • josef — 8:10 AM on May 16, 2012

    one of my teachers once said:

    monopolists do like they want.
    and piracy is the only way to fight a monopoly for a customer.

    [No, you can build competing/disruptive products, or you can buy them to support their development. Being a thief doesn’t improve anything. –J.]

    • AREL KRUEGER — 5:23 PM on May 16, 2012

      I can’t believe that people justify stealing.

  • Nir from Israel — 3:22 PM on May 16, 2012

    ADOBE must make al no US users pay the same for their products.
    We pay more for nothing more – It is not as if we get support on local forums.
    Most of non-US users earn less than the average user in the US ( professionals)on a monthly basis and there is no reason for us to pay even a US$ more.

    Nir
    A legit PS user since PS3.

  • imajez — 5:07 PM on May 16, 2012

    I just number crunched the cost for CCM here in the UK versus buying the CS6 Master Collection.
    2 years sub @ £47/$75 [24 month for full upgrade cycle] = £1,125/$1,790
    Buying CS6 MC = £2667.60 so that’s a big saving, before you even mention you get more products for your money.

    Except there’s a big catch – the upgrade price is £476/$758 which you used to pay every two years. So suddenly CCM seems a bit pricey even if you’ve been upgrading every cycle – even taking into account the extra features.
    And in reality there are probably very few people on the planet who actually can and do use all the Master Suite products, let alone all the extra ones added.

    So it’s kind of hard to promote CCM here in UK when customers not only have to pay 50% more than one would in the US, but double compared to a normal UK upgrade price.
    Plus even after you’ve paid out for two years, you don’t get to keep the product should you decide not to continue subscribing, if say a recession hits or gets deeper, maybe you cannot afford a full subscription anymore. Now this is potentially very serious as previously if times were tight you simply used the older version of the software when upgrade time came. Now if money gets scarce for a content production company, not only can you not afford to upgrade, but suddenly the tools that earn you your money disappear and you will very quickly go out of business.

    I think if after a certain time paying a subscription, you could keep using the older version, I think there would be less qualms about the concept and if you had more flexibility in how you subscribed that would go a long way to easing some concerns.
    For example $20 for a single programme, $25 for 2, $30 for 4, $40 for 7 and $50 for everything.

    • AREL KRUEGER — 5:33 PM on May 16, 2012

      If you are running a trucking company and cannot afford the gasoline for your truck, should they lower the price of the gas? Good Luck with that one! People need to find ways to pay for the tools that make them their money. $2 a day is not a lot of money for a product that is Packed to the Rim with Features. Look for other things you can do without if you are having money problems. Don’t skip payments on the blood of your business.

      • KC — 7:37 AM on May 17, 2012

        If you are running a trucking company and are offered the “option” of subscribing to a monthly service to come put gas at their gas station at a higher rate than you were previously paying—for the option of paying a monthly fee, rather than a per-fill fee—should you pay extra money for nothing? (Oh, and they will offer additional snacks, beverages, and amenities in the shop—none of which you currently use, or plan to use in the future.) Still sound like a good scenario?

        As far as looking to other “things” one can do without—try other software options. Don’t pay hard-earned money from your business when there are much less costly alternatives available.

        • AREL KRUEGER — 2:50 PM on May 17, 2012

          Cheap options are always available, but don’t short yourself.

        • AREL KRUEGER — 2:52 PM on May 17, 2012

          …gas seems to always be higher than it was last month/year. Don’t let that put you out of business. Raise your prices and/or get better at what you do so you can do more for less. It may not be as easy as i make it sound, but something to think about.

  • Robert Barnett — 2:38 PM on May 22, 2012

    Frankly Adobe’s new pricing has really cheesed me off. First you release CS5.5 and then play it down as an update that is not needed unless you are in to tablet publishing and the like. So I skip it since Photoshop got no love in that update.

    Now Adobe is telling me that that was a major update and because I followed Adobe advice and skipped CS5.5 I now have to pay over $1000 to upgrade my CS5 to CS6 when the upgrade from CS5.5 to CS6 is a little over $500.

    Personally, I feel like Adobe just gave me one hell of a bloody rear plowing. It just isn’t fair or right.

    Robert (A Pissed Off Adobe Customer)

  • Nigel Burns — 11:06 PM on May 22, 2012

    Here’s the thing, the subscription option isn’t a problem for me if it was done right. But it’s done wrong. I have CS5 Master Collection, which I bought because it was the best option for me at the time. However, although I get a discount for the first year if I subscribe to creative cloud ($29 intro price), it’s the same discount as if I only had a copy of Photoshop CS3. So where did all the investment value go of me being a Master Collection customer and of a more recent version? It evaporated, and that’s wrong.

    The other thing that’s wrong is Adobe’s claim that updates will be quicker for cloud customers. If the CS6 MC is the same in the cloud and on my desktop, why would they withhold upgrades from customers that bought the software license the old fashioned packaged way? There doesn’t seem to be any possible technical reason for this and so that’s wrong.

    Also, is the Master Collection not so Master, being that the cloud Master Collection has more software? Maybe they should rename the old fashioned packaged Master Collection the “Not so Master Collection”.

    What this all boils down to is that if they had the end-users interest in mind they would have made the ‘upgrade’ or ‘migration’ pricing fairer. And they would release updates to the packaged MC at the same time as on the Cloud.

    Instead what they’ve done is make it complicated and unfair. And so that pisses off customers.

    They keep changing the rules so one has to wonder if they’ll ‘ungroup’ the Cloud MC after everyone is locked in, and then have various levels, with various capabilities at each level, and various ‘priority’ update rights, and various file size rights, and various file naming rights, and how about in Photoshop they add a deluxe red and a plain old standard red for those ‘economy’ customers.

    I think Adobe is modeling their approach after the croquet game in Alice in Wonderland:

    “I don’t think they play at all fairly,” Alice began, in rather a complaining tone, “and they all quarrel so dreadfully one can’t hear one’s self speak—and they don’t seem to have any rules in particular: at least, if there are, nobody attends to them—and you’ve no idea how confusing it is all the things being alive: for instance, there’s the arch I’ve got to go through next walking about at the other end of the ground—and I should have croqueted the Queen’s hedgehog just now, only it ran away when it saw mine coming!”

  • Mark — 9:18 PM on May 24, 2012

    Uhhm, “john..” I sure hope you don’t work for or represent adobe in anyway, and I have to say your childish comments-through out the thread-really just speak to your insecurity, and possibly some interests-beyond the obvious- for promoting this cloud nonsense. I for one won’t be buying in to this “creative scam”, thank you very much.

    [You’re a delight. –J.]

  • Ramón G Castañeda — 12:40 AM on May 25, 2012

    While I wish Adobe the best of luck, I have to wonder where the incentive is for Adobe to keep developing applications once the rental model becomes predominant. I just shudder when I think about the bean counters at Adobe HQ pondering the enormous savings in letting 85% or even 95% or more of the engineering staff go.

    Also, I find the mere thought of paying a monthly tribute to the Adobe corporate monster *forever* terrifyingly depressing.

  • Simon Grant — 10:55 AM on May 25, 2012

    I really think adobe is trying to herd cats on this one, in order to increase revenue, and not giving a damn about what its customers want.

    In the long run this is going to hurt adobe. Sure they may/ or may not, decrease piracy, but if while doing so they’re dragging their base of customers through the mud, it hardly seems like a good strategy. My bet’s on that adobe will drop the cloud only model( for products like muse, and let’s hope not edge), when they start taking a major hit to their bottom line. Hopefully it won’t be too late to get back some of their base of customers who may have been forced to seek out other alternatives.

  • mark o — 5:52 PM on May 25, 2012

    John, I’d like to apologize for the personal tone of my comment. I thought you were a paid shill for adobe in some rentablog, and obviously had no idea who you are. Having said that, I imagine you’re someone who has some say in the direction adobe goes with its products, and as someone who loves adobe products, I hope you guys are listening to what many of your customers are telling you, and that’s really that people just aren’t up for another monthly bill in this day and age.

    I’d say about half the people I work with started out using adobe as teens on some pirated version of photoshop. Most, as they’ve matured have seen the errors of their ways, and are now some of adobe’s most loyal customers. So it’s really a two sided coin, and I’m afraid when it comes to piracy until technology improves there’s no silver bullet, and software rental aint it.

  • Samuel Gelentere — 3:07 PM on June 02, 2012

    Leave creative cloud as an option. Some will like it some won’t.

  • Martin — 10:22 AM on June 28, 2012

    I’m not understanding the frustration here. As someone who didnt upgrade everytime this is way more cost effective then upgrading ppro ps and lightroom individually.

  • Rananjay — 4:52 AM on June 29, 2012

    This is good for countries like US but in my country like India that’s way too much,where most of the adobe users are students who can’t afford this.I think Adobe has to rework on it’s strategies otherwise it will affect them only.

  • Geoff Wise — 3:24 AM on July 02, 2012

    I will not be subscribing to Adobe’s Creative Cloud because as a photographer I only use Photoshop and Lightroom. It makes no sense to pay to get other programs from the creative suite that will take up valuable hard drive space and which I’m never going to use. Perhaps Adobe could put together some smaller program packages at a lower price, until then I’ll keep buying my cheap sandwiches.

  • Ian MacCready — 5:25 AM on July 03, 2012

    1. Creative Cloud is a good thing.

    2. Creative Cloud is not for everyone so buying is better for them.

    Everything else is smoke and mirrors.

    John, a couple of questions:
    1. I use Premiere Pro on a stand-alone machine that’s not normally on the internet and has stripped-down windows to direct more computer resources towards video processing. Upgrades are done in a very careful way. How do upgrades and activation work with the cloud version on a non-connected machine?

    2. I suppose I could look this one up but, the editing machine doesn’t contain the software I don’t need for video editing. The full suite is installed on a separate (connected) machine. Will the CC licence allow for this kind of multi-machine installation?

    3. I guess I’m a little concerned about the “rental” model. How easy is it to turn off/on if I’m going away to (say) shoot for a couple of weeks or a month and then return to edit? Will I be re-installing each time or is it just a matter of going online to re-activate the installation (again, concerns about that non-connected machine)?

    4. If the CC model doesn’t work for me, will I still qualify for the upgrade price on the Master Collection?

    Thanks.

  • Merlean — 2:20 PM on July 24, 2012

    People, you are not looking at Adobe Cloud realistically. I am a veteran designer (spell that pre-Photoshop) which gives me a fatalistic view of Adobe Cloud. Here’s what’s going to happen.

    1- Yes, the cost of an intro-subscription to Cloud is wonderful. But it won’t stay that way. In 3 or 4 years the programs you now have will be obsolete and the cost of upgrading programs will become astronomical. You will HAVE TO get out of the business or purchase Cloud. And at that point the cost of Adobe Cloud will skyrocket. They may offer a discount if you are an original subscriber but I doubt it.

    2- And yes, for a couple years there will be companies that try to compete by designing and selling new programs in the old way. But any company that can design a program to compete with Adobe will quickly see the financial lure of a Cloud – and they will launch their own clouds.

    3- For 5 or 6 years bootlegging will increase but bootlegging only survives today because the government really doesn’t care. If it ever begins to hurt the Clouds they will pool their money, lobby congress, and the penalty for bootlegging (selling or using) will become so great we will just stop.

    4- Bottom line, if you are young you might as well go ahead and subscribe to Adobe Cloud, if you are an older person, or a hobby designer, upgrade immediately, then put your head down for a few years. If you can hold out 6 years you should at least be able to choose “which Cloud Company” suits your needs best. Buying a cloud will be as common and complicated as a cell phone.

    Welcome to the future like it or not.

  • M Groothuis — 3:04 PM on July 28, 2012

    Bottomline should really be: how much of the functions in Adobe software do you REALLY use/need. When people look at that they will begin to realize that a lot of what is inside proprietary (and other) software is either not used or used seldomly.
    If you upgrade your car to the latest model every year you probably won’t change your habits, but if you don’t then perhaps it is time to start looking at the software from the perspective of how much functionality you really need. It is nice to have the cosmetics, but if it takes you from point A to point B in comfort wouldn’t that be enough? And if you don’t know how to drive either software or car beyond the basics, isn’t it pretty pointless to upgrade constantly?

  • Mike — 7:33 PM on July 31, 2012

    I love it. I’m a student and I always had the crappy outdated adobe stuff because I can’t afford the new ones. But with adobe creative cloud ($29 a month for students) I get the latest stuff. I can can afford it when it’s stretched out over such a long period of time. Going with how often I usually update my master suit ($800 for students), it’s almost 2000 more expensive. But now I get Lightroom and a bunch of other cool “perks” and THE LATEST FREEAKING STUFF (Sorry, I’m really exited).

    Final note. Those who use piracy can go to hell (Sorry, I feel really strongly about this). I don’t care if it’s movies or software. I don’t care if you’re starving on the streets of africa and you’re only hope of a better life is to use adobe to help your business and feed you’re starving children (Ok, maybe that might be ok. There must be a charity for that). It’s stealing. Your can stop the “It doesn’t hurt them. They can make another copy for like $0″ because it’s ridicules.

    The next time you download something pirated, just walk into the damn best buy and steal it off the shelf. At least your not cowardly hiding behind you’re proxy and super encoded torrent.

  • Merlean — 7:54 AM on August 02, 2012

    M Groothuis, I think you missed my point. I’m not in favor of clouds. Far from it. I had the first private satellite dish in town, for all the good it did. Took the cable companies less than 3 years to make that illegal. — I’m saying, complain all we want, then resign ourselves to paying for stuff we don’t want in order to get the little we do want. If you can think of any real way to get around it please let me know.

    And Mike the student, If you really think clouds are cheaper you haven’t done your math. Yes, for this first year they are cost effective, maybe even next year, then the price hike will hit. Clouds will soon be the largest monthly bill you have. And that will be the basic plan for just the get-along programs. Just enough program to operate your computer, maybe write a letter. If you want the premium programs “in cable terms think MOVIES or SPORTS” be prepared to shell out the money.

    Soon programs as basic as Acrobat or Google won’t be available without a cloud. When you purchase your next computer you will have to purchase a cloud plan.

    Okay, you won’t HAVE to … you could use your computer as a paper weight!

  • Merlean — 8:21 AM on August 02, 2012

    M Groothuis, sorry, think I misread your comment. Your abhor clouds as much as I do but you are still in the stage where you think common sense will stop them.

    Like I said before if you can think of a real world way to slow them down please let me know.

  • Jenevine — 6:45 PM on August 30, 2012

    I am a student in college, and CC sounds very appealing to me at the moment! I’m taking various classes that use the software that CC provides and I’ve been worrying about how I could afford so many products! Even with the student discount, products are too expensive for a broke college student like I. I know I won’t be able to “keep” the software unless I buy it, but with CC I can try out and experiment with products. Once I am finished with college and become a legit graphic designer, I’ll know which full-version products will be worth the money for me. I can understand why some people oppose it, but for me, I think it’s a great deal.

  • CanDoSandhu — 6:58 AM on October 17, 2012

    I am a wealthy man and I was about to subscribe to Creative Cloud. Once I logged in and the system realised I was in the UK the price changed from $50 to £47.

    That changed my mind. Doesn’t matter how wealthy I am – I will not tolerate being ripped-off.

    I’m pretty sure the Creative Cloud non-USA pricing model will only achieve one thing; promote piracy.

  • Andy — 12:56 PM on October 26, 2012

    I note the author’s frequent responses on all manner of issues here but, unless I’m missing something, he hasn’t addressed the common concern raised by non-US customers – why are we paying so much more than the US customer base? I own Master Collection and I’ve upgraded three times. Until now the price difference has been justified (rather poorly) as “localization” and cost of doing business overseas.

    I’m happy to download the US product and deal with tech support there on Skype as I do for several other products. besides which, your tech support probably lives closer to me than to the Adobe Campus.

    I’m studying online with a US university right now. They don’t go “hang on, you’re in South Africa – we need to bill you double for the same course material.”

    Wy are we expected to pay so much more?

  • Dan — 6:09 PM on November 21, 2012

    Does Adobe know they make overpriced crap? I paid over $1,800 for a legal copy of Creative Suite. Flash doesn’t work on Apple products. Fireworks crashes, and Dreamweaver is a living nightmare. Now Adobe wants to bill my credit card?

  • Average UK Guy — 9:29 AM on December 11, 2012

    People pirate PhotoShop because it so well supported in terms of books, magazines and tutorials. It is THE standard for photo editing, after all we don’t say ‘Why don’t we Gimp his head on a donkey?”.

    Many people want to be able to use it but it is priced way out of the range of probably 90% of home users/students. Most people who pirate it will never sell anything they make with it, so buying it would see no return on the investment.

    The whole rental thing is a farce as if you bought your software you’d use it for a few years not just the year that the rental price costs. Also the price is still to high for most home users.

    Most people who criticize people pirating software are artists, journalists and tech experts with high paying jobs (even if they appreciate that they are well off compared to most).

    Here in the UK, the average home user isn’t going to spend more than £100 on a software package. By average I’m talking non-commercial, hobbiest users NOT artists, designers, etc. People who want to use the best and can’t understand why they are shut out by ridiculous pricing.

    Some price ideas for the UK:

    Students/disabled/long term unemployed: £0 – Just like Autodesk, Maxon and REAL Software

    Home User, single licence, non-commercial: £89.99

    Home User, single licence, commercial: £189.99

    The corporate pricing as it stands is fine…

  • Paul — 3:50 PM on March 27, 2013

    I think we can agree that if you don’t owned a license of CS then this model might make sense; however to the small businesses that has purchased the software already this doesn’t make sense, at least not financially. I can tell you that we are on CLP pricing program (which is set to expire and will not be renewed. “can I say forced”) and we are using CS Design Premium. My last renewal of 2 year maintenance works out to about $22 a month per user. This compared to $50 a month for the cloud offering and only for the first year and $70 for the next. That is more then triple the cost and I can guarantee my IT budget has not tripled. Yes you do get more applications, but that doesn’t mean they will be used. We typically use Photoshop, InDesign and Acrobat. I have no problem with the subscription model when it is fair. First off give me back my investment in months of cloud service not a discount. I think a $1,800 price tag should be worth maybe 2 years of free cloud.

    The other major concern I have is the rent-a-software solution. I can tell you that like many companies we suffered during the recession and during which we did little upgrades to our hardware and software. If our applications were all on a rental model we would probably not be here now and would have contributed to unemployment line.

    Business has picked up and we are more up to date now and we can afford to because there is a revenue stream, but I can guarantee there will be more times where the economy tanks and then what. I guess we could go back to hand drawings.

    Autodesk is another monopoly in their realm of software and they are subscription based for maintenance, support and cloud services, but they won’t cut off my software if I don’t renew. Sure I will have to pay later, but hopefully I will be able to afford it then. They did however force us to go to a larger suite of software at a higher yearly cost, but it was only about 30% premium.

    I could tolerate a marginal increase for the additional programs and services, but for the software to cease working when you stop paying is harsh reality that we may all have to face. Maybe we can all triple our fees.

  • magusat999 — 8:43 AM on March 29, 2013

    I also believe this cloud business is utter crap. Its very simple, no matter how little you are paying per month, you don’t have a base app that you own. If Adobe had a plan, whereby you could access the cloud for $5.00 per month after buying their software, I could see the value in it. $50.00 per month, with no ownership and shutdown upon non-payment is a terrible “option” and a total rip-off. Also the guerrilla tactics of only offering updates (that is within version updates, as opposed to upgrades to another version) is complete bullshit, insulting and inconsiderate of user who outright purchased Adobe’s software. Adobe has always freely allowed customers to update their software, now not only are they slyly forcing you to pay for the updates – they are telling you you can’t even get them unless you subscribe to the Creative Cloud. One example of this is you can’t use the “unembed” or “package” functions in Illustrator CS6 unless you “update” it – and you can’t update it unless you are in the Creative Cloud – even if you purchased it outright. Is tying basic functionality to purchasing the Creative Cloud fair to users who have purchased the product outright? Ridiculous!

    Those actions are not stopping piracy and warez sharing, its promoting and prompting it to proliferate even more. There is a cracking team called X-Force who was prosecuted around the time Adobe began to roll out this scam; they were a highly skilled team able to crack software that other crack groups couldn’t even touch. I think it was no co-incident that they were aggressively pursued within the same time-frame of Adobe’s Creative Cloud unveiling, because of all the groups out there, X-Force was a major pain. They probably thought this would hinder crack groups – but this just gave them fuel. It’s interesting that Adobe has tied this rip-off to anti-piracy, because its not going to work. This isn’t about piracy, its about getting you to pay more for less – or in this case, nothing at all unless you keep up the payments.

    I’d rather keep my Starbucks money – along with any other discretionary income, tyvm.

  • Chris — 12:36 PM on April 11, 2013

    And once you are “hooked” they will up the price or take away unlimited access. LIKE VERIZON DID.

  • Andre — 6:40 AM on April 18, 2013

         Why is that the Adobe Staff is pushing so hard we all get on the cloud. Here ya go Swing over to Yahoo and see that The baord voted to reinstate the 2003 Equity Incentive plan.
    Equity Incentive is stock options that incease the amount of shares to by 17.5 mil so at a 45 dollar a share price we are talking about 18×45 810 milion on stock. I think the employes should get paid well. For sure but as for the cloud it is a profit beast set up to get 2x or 3x more money out of you a year.
    http://biz.yahoo.com/e/130412/adbe8-k.html
     
     
    The plan with the cloud is to “Funnel” you into the free or promo price then the price goes up.
     
    Adobe said its Creative Cloud exceeded 500,000 paid individual members and free and trial memberships exceeded 2 million, which the company said could lead to more paid membership.

     
    The company said it added about 153,000 net paid subscriptions during the first quarter and that it expects to reach 1.25 million paid subscriptions by the end of this year.
     
    A Win Win for everyone the share holders see high earnings the staff see some stock options. The only looser is you the consumer. Sorry Adobe be truthfull with us without us you do not thrive!
    upon reading this and the  confrence call I had an AHAAA moment as to Why they cloud is the only option from the mouth of anyone working at ADOBE
    Do yourselves a favor get off the cloud let Adobe come back down to earth. Watch the stock drop. Then upgrade as normal next year if you do there will an Adobe to buy from in ten years if not they may go away. If you own the stock sell ASAP the insiders are!
    http://finance.yahoo.com/q/it?s=ADBE+Insider+Transactions
    also note how much naryeen sells over 1mil shares this year
    http://biz.yahoo.com/t/08/4204.html

  • Paul Bullock — 1:40 PM on April 18, 2013

    Well as the IT Manager of a private company I have decided not move to the cloud offering for now. We are on CS6 currently and this should suffice for now. We already have an existing investment in the software and don’t feel an urgency to move to the cloud. I am starting to hate the word cloud but it might be a great discription for where Adobe is right now. I think they should have had more incentive for their corporate customers to move to the cloud then simply giving them a discount for the first year. It feels like a slap to the face for investing in the first place. For companies like this where they pretty much have a monopoly it takes the customer to make them sit up and notice. Let’s hope they do.

  • Alok Jain — 1:50 AM on April 26, 2013

    They are not providing Asobe Creative Cloud subscription in all countries. For example it’s not available for purchase online in India. You should contact Adobe sales team for this, and they are really lazy in responding.

  • Dalibor Kalna — 6:38 AM on May 07, 2013

    I have subscribed immediately to Adobe CC last year. But because of huge difference in price for US nad Non-US citizens and lack of projects I can’t pay for this anymore. I had to cancel my subscription after one year.

  • Eric Ortner — 7:48 AM on May 07, 2013

    If you ask me, Creative Cloud costs twice as much. I’ve routinely only upgraded the software every other release for approximately $600. Now I need to spend $600 every year. This really stinks for individuals like me that primarily use the software on a job site and want a copy at home in the rare occasion that they do work on the side. I really don’t make $600 in freelance work a year.

    I hope this opens the market to other small companies like Aldus (There’s a blast from the past remember freehand?) to undersell Adobe and give them some real competition again.

  • Toltepeceno — 8:45 AM on May 08, 2013

    THe Adobe Creative cloud is not really cloud based, you download it to your computer and it checks in monthly. Since it’s local it will do nothing to stop piracy, it’s just a pricing change.

    Look how well windows calling in for activation has worked.

    Pirates will come up with a way to make it think it has already called in. Just like with windows.

  • Fuad Kamal — 5:08 PM on May 09, 2013

    Hi John, I’ve long been a diehard when it comes to using the latest releases of software from Adobe, but this move to CC has me stopped short. I’m glad I have a Master Collection edition of CS5, and while I’ve really enjoyed the free year of CC I had since the previous MAX, when it runs out in a few days, I’m considering uninstalling all my CS6 apps and re-installing CS5. I’ve been patient enough to put up with having to uninstall and reinstall Adobe Application manager almost every time there is an update to the software (it seems the Mac OSX version of Adobe App Manager is severely buggy), and I’ve bit back my frustration of not being able to access my CS6 applications when I’m offline – I work on a laptop when I’m out of my office and if I haven’t opened Dreamweaver etc for a while on that machine, it will try to validate my CC subscription (adobe says it does this at least once a month) – no Internet, then no access to the application that is installed on your machine. Frankly, though, I strongly disagree with Adobe on the limit of only installing applications on two machines – it seems counterintuitive to the entire concept of the cloud. If Adobe wants to embrace the cloud, then they need to embrace the concept of allowing a user to purchase software once and then run it on ALL their devices – not just on two devices. Apple has taken the opposite approach – they make the software super cheap -affordable by everyone – look at the drastic price drop from Final Cut 7 to Final Cut X – and you can install on many, many (infinite number?) of machines – as long as you are who you say you are – i.e. you install using your unique iTunes ID, you can use the software you paid for. There is no subscription fees, either. You pay once and you are done. Small update increments are free and if you love the software then you are willing to pay for an upgrade when a totally new version comes out. Frankly, under the Creative Cloud, I don’t see any incentive for Adobe to make significant, ground breaking advances in their software, moving forward. There is no reason to do so because you don’t need to come up with reasons for users to buy the next version of your software – there is no “new” version – just bug fixes and minor updates, forever. And I think Adobe did a good job of proving this at the Day One keynote at MAX this year – all the updates to Photoshop were minor tweaks at best – good things, for sure, but definitely not worthy of air time during the Keynote. This is in stark contrast to every MAX preceding this year. Maybe Adobe should stop asking the end users to consider how “cheap” the cost of renting their software and never actually owning it will be, and consider instead how much more money they stand to make if they lower the cost of software and therefore make it more accessible to more people.

    Yes, I see Adobe has a need to reduce software piracy and crack down on the gray market. I don’t think the current approach with CC is the way to do it – all this is doing is pissing off the users and forcing us to look elsewhere for our software needs. There are far better ways to break the gray market, including the approach Apple uses with Apple ID. With such a model, and lowering the software cost, you may well convert the gray market of software pirates to a legit paid market as well. How many customers do you think you might gain in China, alone?

    Maybe you should drop the corporate-level software licenses that let users install desktop software on infinite machines with no accountability of who is installing or using the software. If your software isn’t checking for a valid license, but rather needs an active Adobe ID that has a registered purchase of the software, your software piracy issue should be over.

    Bottom line is, I don’t at all buy the excuse that the new CC model has anything at all to do with reducing software piracy. I get the impression, on many fronts (such as dropping the bomb PR-wise with Flex and LiveCycle, by removing almost all the development side of the house at MAX, and so forth) that Adobe is facing some challenging management issues in the face of an unfriendly market. I pray they find a strategy that works – one that focuses on the needs of the folks who use Adobe products rather than on the value of Mr. Narayen’s stock options.

  • Shawn — 8:15 AM on May 10, 2013

    I don’t see this model going far.

  • Keith Reeder — 10:27 AM on May 10, 2013

    “A lot of comments on here blindly backing Adobe”

    So any comment that doesn’t agree with yours is “Blindly backing” Adobe, eh?

    Here’s a shocker for you – I’m smart enough to be able to figure out ALL BY MYSELF that this is likely to be a damn’ good deal for some people, and not so good for others.

    That DOES NOT make it inherently, intrinsically, a bad thing.

  • ned — 11:34 AM on May 11, 2013

    This article is foolishly myopic.

    Does the author really think that my friend Tohir (in Dushabe, Tajikistan) who makes between 100 and $150 per month doing graphic and web design (a good wage there) is going to start shelling out $50/mo for cloud access? How about the 14 y.o. doing youtube videos in his basement?

    “No Brainer” creative professionals are not the ones that are pirating these apps. Also, these creative professional who have been buying SW for the last 20 years are not happy to see their prices double or triple. To maintain CS from 9/03 to 9/13 cost about $3200 to ug every version, every other version about $2000, continuous cloud access at today’s rate would be $6000.

  • Nico — 3:37 AM on May 20, 2013

    I’ve yet to see anyone do what was my only choice of survival so far.
    Since I couldn’t afford the price for the master suite, I got a loan for 2k euros, then pay off the loan with 56Euro installments for a 36month period.
    Yes, I do the exact same thing, but, at the end of the 36months, I WILL own it.
    Same with renting a house. It’s cheaper to get a loan and buy it, then pay the loan.
    If for some reason I really should go bankrupt in the remaining time, then I can still sell the license of the CS6 master collection I have AND make a profit from it. Should I go bankrupt AFTER the time is up, I’ll still have to CS6 tools and won’t be thrown out entirely by the situation and will be able to restart my business without the initial investment.

    If anything, I was always taught to try and keep my monthly costs to a minimum. (The loan being the only exemption since I’m almost always kept even by the fact that I can sell what I bought with it)
    Should I buy into the CC system, then I’ll be stuck with it for life. Not just 36months. Should something happen, I can’t really ‘sell’ my subscription, now can I? I have no physical gain from the subscription other than upgrades, which will prove to be everything.
    I’ll only join if the upgrades turn out to be unrealistically improving and at a constant rate.

  • Steve — 11:25 AM on June 06, 2013

    Another long-time user/upgrader – currently CS6 Production Premium.

    I will not be subscribing to Creative Cloud for the same reasons stated by others:

    – projected costs higher
    – future cost uncertain
    – future upgrades uncertain
    – need to keep paying in order to open my own files!

    Any one is enough for me to say ‘no’, but the last one is the final insulting blow. Looks like Adobe doesn’t want customers, but hostages.

    Microsoft’s Office model is right – offer both and make both reasonable.

    Hopefully Adobe will listen quick and offer reasonable perpetual licensing before too much ill will comes there way.

    As a software industry player battling piracy for years, I can assure that Adobe’s move will promote piracy as well. Pirates are emboldened by unfair pricing, and CC gives people more to complain about than before.

  • Gene Pool — 6:58 AM on June 21, 2013

    I use Sagelight for most of my work, and have not used Photoshop for a couple of years now. It takes Photoshop plugins and is veery fast.

  • mike ornellas — 10:46 PM on July 31, 2013

    I find a cloud only option is a foolish business model because it reduces an additional income stream for Adobe. The story of it would be too costly for Adobe to offer both CD and Cloud based software is a crock. Realistically, because of the new cloud model, it will only increase cracking the software. Locking users out of their own files is a huge issue with intellectual personal property.

    That is where many people would balk at the cloud.

    Ironically, the old marketing tag line of Adobe was, “we love choice”.

    Now, Adobe is working on the next generation would be more in line with…

    “we love to screw our customers”

  • Ann Shelbourne — 7:02 AM on August 02, 2013

    My guess is that the reason that Adobe are offering free subscriptions to Photoshop World attendees is that Subscription purchases (and renewals too) are running way behind the predicted level and this is probably being reflected in a falling number of NAP memberships and bookings for PW.

    I am finding that perhaps 90% of photographers and designers with whom I am in contact are refusing to subscribe to the Cloud and the blocking point is definitely the refusal by Adobe to provide a Safe Exit package.

    Introductory pricing is seen as reasonable but the doubling of the rate in the second year is considered to be excessive –particularly by the majority who have neither need nor desire to use more than four or five of the offered applications.

    PW attendees may accept their free gift but you can expect that few will renew their subscriptions after the first year UNLESS Adobe addresses the issues of pricing and, particularly, the over-riding requirement for a safe exit buy-out.

  • Steve — 11:54 PM on August 02, 2013

    As a stockholder all I can say is “Thanks Adobe”, as a 25 year user all I can say is “Goodbye Adobe”

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